A pit maneuver at 80-90 leaves two dead.

[Teufelhunden]

You might have seen this discussed on other sites. I thought I'd try to get a police officer's point of view, since we have Pig Pen here.

http://208.185.54.25/wm.gannett/wxia/meeks_082304.wmv

Any opinions?

Mesa's draft policy would make a PIT at 35 mph or above considered a use of deadly force. The policy would not allow the method to be used during pursuits of motorcycles. (http://www.policedriving.com/article67.htm)

The PIT is not applicable in every situation. Typical police policy is not to attempt the PIT at greater than 35 miles per hour (55 kilometers per hour). Its effective use requires careful choice of location, considering all possible effects on other traffic and pedestrians. Because of the police department's potential liability for the injury or death not only of the occupants of the target vehicle but also to bystanders, most departments limit its use to only the most high-risk scenarios. Most departments specify that the PIT should only be used to stop pursuits that are immediately dangerous and ongoing. When possible, three pursuers should be present when a PIT is executed: one as the PIT vehicle and two following at a greater distance to react to the results. (http://www.free-definition.com/PIT-maneuver.html)

http://www.policedriving.com/article57.htm

[Ricky Bobby]

thats seems a little to fast to do that im surprised it didnt start to tumble and catch air at 86 mph 35 shouldnt be bad but thats just my opinion

[fireguyrick]

I think that it was unfortunate that they were killed, but I would side with the police on this one. Generally when people run it is either a fight or flight response or they are running for a reason. The initial adrenaline rush would NOT have lasted 70 miles. i believe the female driver's father was a police officer, and even he said that he did not blame the police department.

Rick

[lotsals1]

what a dumb ass--you dont do the pit at 80mph ! and on a suv!
that is suppose to be done only after spike strips and road blocks failed
they should be let go for that and sued !
21 and 17 what a waist

[Anakonda69]

sorry no matter what her crime was or wasn't he did the right thing....after 70 miles endangering innocent people just driving on the freeway no other choice.....don't blame the trooper one bit...

[Al]

...because she could have crashed into another car and taken innocent people with her.

I side with the cops on that one for doing their jobs.

Stupid kid. That is all I can say for her.

As for the pit manuver, there should be some discretion about using it at high speeds and on SUVs.

I am also in favor of spike strips when you can predict that they could be going down the freeway like that. A road block would work along with a cop pulling in front.

[Neal Steffek]

I hope the cops get sued and, along with the one who OK's it get life in prision.

The fact that it went on for 70 miles means nothing, you could have used spike strips, or some other safer way well before this. Road block even. Just goes to show, that there are some dumb ass cops out there. (not all of them though)

[Anakonda69]

is there really any "safe" way to stop a vehicle at 80+ mph? yes they should have exhausted every other means of stopping it before they did that but how many of us have been in that position? chasing a vehicle at that speed with your job being to stop the vehicle causing as little damage to everything around especially the people involved......your mindset has got to be unimaginable...

[Prince Valiant]

yes, because road blocks on the busiest hwy in the US is the easiest thing to pull off.

I mean, certianly I saw plenty of gaps in the traffic where cops could have easily set-up and thrown the spikes out as well. That was clearly the case in the video. Plenty of opportunity to anticipate locations to pull this off.

I mean, why didn't the cops just ask the girl nicely to pull over? Did they even think of that? I mean, it's a completely reasonable action to just run when a cop shows up behind you with lights flashing. Completely Reasonable.

And what's the harm in someone weaving in and out of traffic at more nearly double the speed limit? In an SUV none-the-less?!? Heck, if anything, it would be safer! Why shouldn't people be allowed to keep going if they don't want to stop for the cops? What don't those pigs understand?

Those cold-blooded cops were just looking for people to kill.

:rolleyes:

I really don't feel to sorry for her. I feel sorry for the police officer whose going to have a bunch of dumb@ss's treating him as if he murdered some sweet, innocent girl that posed absolutely no harm to others...and should then therefore he should spend his life in prison :rolleyes:

sh!t, just look at what they do to people in south africa for stealing a car.

[Jake B. (Killer Quad)]

as a person who has never done anything worse than speeding and some reckless driving! I feel the cops choice on how to end this chase was just and needed befor she took lives of good law abiding citizens.
My view is when you flee the law in this manner and are driving in such a way you have now put the lives of the officers in danger too! They have to do what ever they can as soon as they can for the publics safty and thier own! Any chase that exceeds 3 minutes the person fleeing obviously is willing to give there life if they can avoid being cought!

my 2 cents

now back to modding the car to make sure them Crown Vics cant get close enough to read the plate!

[Brian98GTP]

That girl gave up her rights when she started putting innocent people's lives in danger....
It kind of makes you wonder about the other kid in the car....
Was he yelling at her to stop for 70+ miles, or was he telling her to go faster the whole time.... He's dead, so we'll never know for sure...

Also, think of it this way...
What if the chase went on for another 5 miles, and she ended up losing control of the SUV and hitting a school bus killing a bunch of kids...

Would people be bitching about how the cops didnt do anything drastic to stop the chase in the first 70 miles?? Would parents of the 'killed children' want to sue the Law Enforcement Agencies for 'Lack of Action'??? I DEFINATELY think they would....
The Officers did what they felt was right....They are trained to make split second decisions in dangerous situations....
I also feel bad for what the officers will have to face in the future.....(media, people calling them murderers, having to deal with the fact that they killed someone in the line of duty...etc...)

Thats how I personally feel about it anyways....

Oh, and I almost forgot.....








V100 CAN SUCK MY BALLS!!! :banana





---------------------------

[SMS 1]

C'mon Lotsals1 and Neal, you guys are smarter than that :confused WTF were they supposed to do? Chases that go on this long only end one way, in a TC. Either because the cops take'em out or the driver loses it. And she obviously had no intention of slowing down anytime soon. Sure it's too bad blah blah blah but she WOULD have lost control at some point trying to get away, guaranteed.

[Pig Pen]

P.I.T. manuvers are not used in Wisconsin (typically). Its pretty easy to toss the **** at the officers on this one, but I'm looking for a show of hands in the audience here to see how many of us have been through an EVAC course at a State of Wisconsin Police Academy? Just like Monday morning coaching, you can play the coulda shoulda game with this cops life, but he made a decision and he made the RIGHT decision to end a high speed chase on a busy road in a successful maner. The broad in this case was using a speeding SUV in blantant disregard to her OWN safety, she was using this vehicle as a weapon, whether or not with malice or intent. The officer made the right call and ended the chase with a vehicle manuver that is considered okay by some departments in thier pursuit or use of deadly force sections of their policy. Too bad she died, but at the same time, why did she run? She didn't have to, and now I got to hear a bunch of people cry over the fact that she was a sh!t head, decided to play the game, and lost. Too bad is right, she should have just shot herself, then we can blame her parents for not hugging her enough.

Police are not your punching bag for when some sh!t head dies at thier hands, take a look at the person who the police just put down instead.

[Pig Pen]

I hope the cops get sued and, along with the one who OK's it get life in prision.

The fact that it went on for 70 miles means nothing, you could have used spike strips, or some other safer way well before this. Road block even. Just goes to show, that there are some dumb ass cops out there. (not all of them though)

Are you not the assclown that doesn't even have a liscence anymore? No wonder you side with trash.

[Prince Valiant]

P.I.T. manuvers are not used in Wisconsin (typically). I have heard of the milwaukee county using it before on 94 southbound a couple years ago IIRC, so as you point out, it's not unheard of.

[Cryptic]

when does one get a clue that your definetly not going to get away. maybe only another 70 miles she would of figured it out.

Sad story... not cops fault by any means. Next time make sure your get away car has boost :thumbsup

[GTSLOW]

I think he did the right thing and support him! What if he hadnt done it and she ran into a bus of kids and killed 50 of them?

[BadAzzGTA89]

In my thinking on this the department should have tried a lil harder to avoid this !I mean who knows how long the chase was but the power of the motorolla gives the police an advantage in any case !Remeber to protect and serve is the job at hand. And keep your man alive to serve his or her crime in the end shows justice!To learn from there wrong doings! But in this case bad choises were made.I just feel do the crime servre the time not happining here!!!!!!

[Neal Steffek]

Are you not the assclown that doesn't even have a liscence anymore? No wonder you side with trash.

WTF did this come from? Who gave you the right to come down on me for stateing my opinion? I kept my mouth shut when SMS called me out becasue he didn't get personal or try to make himself feel better by trying to take me down a peg on my persoanl demons. And for that I can respect him.

But you are a total piece of ****. **** you and the horse you rode in on. What the **** do you think makes me trash, or the person that died? Do you know me? Do you know the person that died? Who the **** do you think you are? Are you really a cop in West Allis? In that case, eat my asshole. Maybe I should have sucked a **** to become a cop in Stallis cause then the **** I did to lose my licence would be legal for me in my cop car. Maybe you don't know this, but I was born and raised in Stallis, I know the **** that the cops do, and get away with. The people that know me know that I am a stand up guy. But I would love to know that can say that about you. Why don't you go give out some parking tickets or semething.

**** this, you are not woth me writing bullshit on the internet about you anymore and wasteing my time. Eat a ****. :flipoff2:

[BadAzzGTA89]

I think ya ment the falls^^^^^^ :thumbsup

[Neal Steffek]

Yea I see that now. And I know how much the crime like this the Falls has like this (hi speed chases) that he can give such an experianced opinion on. :rolf :durr

[VroomPshhTsi]

It's hard to stereotype an entire group of people. I know that there are plenty of good cops out there, but there are a certain few @$$hole cops in New Berlin and West Allis.... the one in West Allis cost me over $4500!! :flipoff2:
And a bunch of New Berlin cops have nothing better to do than chase after and tail any car on the road after 2 am :fire ...

I can't "hate" the cop for what he did in the 80 mph pit move.... he made a choice, however it turned out to be the wrong one. He should be punished in some form, but not severe (and none of this "suspended with pay" bull$hit) ....

[Al]

Well, I am certain that most of the cops in the country have heard about this one by now. The pit guidelines will probably be rewritten so this shouldn't happen again.

BTW- how long till that thing would have run out of gas?

[Pig Pen]

WTF did this come from? Who gave you the right to come down on me for stateing my opinion? I kept my mouth shut when SMS called me out becasue he didn't get personal or try to make himself feel better by trying to take me down a peg on my persoanl demons. And for that I can respect him.

But you are a total piece of ****. **** you and the horse you rode in on. What the **** do you think makes me trash, or the person that died? Do you know me? Do you know the person that died? Who the **** do you think you are? Are you really a cop in West Allis? In that case, eat my asshole. Maybe I should have sucked a **** to become a cop in Stallis cause then the **** I did to lose my licence would be legal for me in my cop car. Maybe you don't know this, but I was born and raised in Stallis, I know the **** that the cops do, and get away with. The people that know me know that I am a stand up guy. But I would love to know that can say that about you. Why don't you go give out some parking tickets or semething.

**** this, you are not woth me writing bullshit on the internet about you anymore and wasteing my time. Eat a ****. :flipoff2:

Well spoken, just like I thought you were... We average about 1 SWAT team call up a month, hold the Midwests largest meth lab drug raids, busted an armed robber just 2 weeks ago on Q and 43, and had 2 car chases that went into Milwaukee or cam from Milwaukee... Then again, your some closed mind individual thats a stand up guy, but you've been p!ssed on by the man your whole life and held back. Your the tops!

[Neal Steffek]

Well spoken, just like I thought you were... We average about 1 SWAT team call up a month, hold the Midwests largest meth lab drug raids, busted an armed robber just 2 weeks ago on Q and 43, and had 2 car chases that went into Milwaukee or cam from Milwaukee... Then again, your some closed mind individual thats a stand up guy, but you've been p!ssed on by the man your whole life and held back. Your the tops!


Good thing I left that drug lab right before the scary MF SWAT team busted all my homies. :rolleyes:

[Go Speed]

Am I the only one that found humor in the comment the officer made about 'executing' the right manuver.


Anyway - I think the officers did the right thing. She had no choice other than to accept the consequences of her actions and unfortunately (for her) she paid the ultimate price. Her actions were as deadly as his - the difference is the officer's actions were necessary to curb hers.

[Pig Pen]

All your homies huh...I guess you "chill" with 40 year old fat white guys that look like Ron Jeremy. Your cooler then I thought! Whatever the case my be, atleast I know I can go to bed not worrying if your a better person then me, its obvious I am.

[Neal Steffek]

All your homies huh...I guess you "chill" with 40 year old fat white guys that look like Ron Jeremy.

That is exacty what my friends look like! (and not to mention everyone in my family.)


atleast I know I can go to bed not worrying if your a better person then me, its obvious I am.

Don't worry about it. You are still a **** sucker.

[Al]

All your homies huh...I guess you "chill" with 40 year old fat white guys that look like Ron Jeremy. Your cooler then I thought! Whatever the case my be, atleast I know I can go to bed not worrying if your a better person then me, its obvious I am.

I would have never guessed that one!