Dyno Tuners in Eastern WI?

[DNT H8]

Hello all... I know there are a few dyno tuners in the area, but any that would be more versed with modular Fords? Specifically the Coyote motor, from what Im able to gather they are quite interesting and difficult to tune... Thank you for any input BCM.

[STANMAN]

Marv is going to be your best bet locally. If you're willing to make a drive (8 hours), Brenspeed would be my recommendation. They put you up in their guest house, and are just awesome guys all the way around. It's not just a job to Brent and his staff, they are all Mustang people.

[73MACH]

congrats on the new order!!

[DNT H8]

Marv is going to be your best bet locally. Thanks for the info... who is Marv?


congrats on the new order!!
Thanks bro... its a really fun ride.

[CRISIS]

Marv is c & m performance in hubertus, wi.

[Irish]

Anyone but Marv or Forest.

[CRISIS]

I 2nd forest!! Avoid!

[DNT H8]

Thank you two for the honest intel...

So is there no one localy worth utilizing, or just no modular Ford tuners.

[Josepy]

Thank you two for the honest intel...

So is there no one localy worth utilizing, or just no modular Ford tuners.


Call West Bend Dyno tuning. Tell them I sent you.

[BAD LS1]

WBD can do coyote mills thru diablosport. Probably using a DS trinity and cmr to do the custom end of it. They personally have alot of experience with 3V stuff including some higher HP FI ones. Though have only seen a handful of 11 plus 5.0's which were bolt ons. Really the tuning aspect won't be a ton diff than a 3v Spanish oak setup, plus there are tons of forums for help/guidance.

Just all depends which hand held brand you want to be married to for doing the physical calibrations.

[Irish]

Though have only seen a handful of 11 plus 5.0's which were bolt ons. Really the tuning aspect won't be a ton diff than a 3v Spanish oak setup.

No offense, I would not take my brand new car to be tuned by someone that has only tuned a handful. I would want the peace of mind that comes with taking the car to someone that has had a ton of experience with this platform.


plus there are tons of forums for help/guidance.


This is not what I would want to hear from my tuner, regarding tuning my car.

[VroomPshhTsi]

No offense, I would not take my brand new car to be tuned by someone that has only tuned a handful. I would want the peace of mind that comes with taking the car to someone that has had a ton of experience with this platform.



True but that engine has only been out for a couple years so I don't think anyone will have a ton of experience with it.

[Irish]

I don't think anyone will have a ton of experience with it.

I disagree. There are more than a few tuners (across the country) that have tuned more than "a handful" and only specialize in Modular Engines and Coyotes.

[BAD LS1]

Can't make people happy with an honest response, it's a catch 22. The OP has many choices, I'm not fighting for him to take his car anywhere in particular. It was more in response to Joe's post and wanted to make sure the OP got a fair explanation.

Since you have so much valuable insight to the OP on this subject, how about providing some possible solutions by name for him instead of saying "anywhere" and not where to go?

I'll start:
How about livernois in MI? They have appear to have plenty of coyote experience. Seen to have plenty of fast examples around.

[Sprayaway Fox]

If I had a new 5.0 I would feel more comfy with Bad LS1 doing the work over Marv. I know Tom can do wonders with LS engines id throw him the keys to my 5.0. I met Tom and he rebuilt my T56 a while back. He was a stand up guy.
I sat in a car with a Marv tune that was never right and went back a couple of times....More of a PITA than anything else.

Its just like the auto industry. Your big shops get all the first work then the curve goes to smaller shops. Marv might have mustangs stacked up like cordwood out back but IMO id feel more comfy with Tom....Before you bite the bullet on it, get to know your tuner though as most likely you will be riding with him a couple more times on tunes after you mod more.

My experience is mostly based on actual converstations with both. When the chips are down and shit isnt acting right I felt that Tom would of been better to handle the situation.

[BAD LS1]

If I had a new 5.0 I would feel more comfy with Bad LS1 doing the work over Marv. I know Tom can do wonders with LS engines id throw him the keys to my 5.0. I met Tom and he rebuilt my T56 a while back. He was a stand up guy.
I sat in a car with a Marv tune that was never right and went back a couple of times....More of a PITA than anything else.

Its just like the auto industry. Your big shops get all the first work then the curve goes to smaller shops. Marv might have mustangs stacked up like cordwood out back but IMO id feel more comfy with Tom....Before you bite the bullet on it, get to know your tuner though as most likely you will be riding with him a couple more times on tunes after you mod more.

Thanks for acknowledgement.

I agree with the parts about getting to know the tuner's abilities on calibration tweaks, watch them work, analyze how methodical they are and how well they understand the theory of what their adjustment affects. You can figure out pretty quick how good of hands you are in with out having to be an expert on the subject. Ask lots of questions too. They should be able to tell you precisely what the affect of a certain adjustment will be and why it's done. It's pretty easy to tell when you are being baffled with bullshit.

[*SNOOP*]

I can tell you this, Tom will be getting my brand new 2014 C7 LT1 with 20 miles on it (distance from dealer to Toms house) that we have no idea about tuning......... and BOOSTING THAT BITCH!!!

[Irish]

Can't make people happy with an honest response, it's a catch 22. The OP has many choices, I'm not fighting for him to take his car anywhere in particular. It was more in response to Joe's post and wanted to make sure the OP got a fair explanation.

Since you have so much valuable insight to the OP on this subject, how about providing some possible solutions by name for him instead of saying "anywhere" and not where to go?

I'll start:
How about livernois in MI? They have appear to have plenty of coyote experience. Seen to have plenty of fast examples around.

Stirred the hornets nest with my response lol?

"Disclaimer" - At no time did I state that Thomas was an incapable tuner.

I simply provided my thoughts on the subject. With that being said, D8 is resourceful enough to visit other mustang specific forums to find the knowledge he is seeking. From there, he can make his own, informed decision.

Furthermore, I should have prefaced my original post with,

"If I was new to this area, and didnt really trust any shops yet, I would expand the distance I was willing to travel in order to ensure I was going to a shop that is experienced with tuning the Coyote platform."


In other words, don't get butthurt because I didn't drink the kool-aid.

[BlackLightning]

Anyone but Marv or Forest.

+1.

Don't find this out the hard way and avoid both.

[Ricky Bobby]

If I ever get a efi car that needs tuning it will go to Tom one I know tom and he doesnt do shit work he will stick with it and help in any way possible.

[WhatsADSM]

FWIW I am also at WBD and have tuned my share of high tech (variable intake, variable cam phased, valve lift, model based) ecus. So while there is certainly something to be said about going to a tuner that exclusively tunes a specific platform (and i don't believe there are any exclusively coyote experts in the area) there is also a ton of collective knowledge at WBD. I wouldn't hesitate to take a coyote powered car there. Tom's, Brian's, and my own reputation speak for themselves.

[stealthy1ss]

Just because someone has tuned a lot of a certain kind of car or a lot of cars in general doesn't mean they are a good tuner.

[Irish]

Just because someone has tuned a lot of a certain kind of car or a lot of cars in general doesn't mean they are a good tuner.

I would feel more comfortable taking my $25-$30,000 car to someone that KNOWS the platform.

I won't say anything derogatory about WBD, however, I personally will not take anything there.

To the OP, it's your car, do what you want.

[michelle]

I'd go with Livernois. Beautiful shop, awesome employees, and a great reputation.

Personally drove one of their "tuned" cars and was quite impressed!

[DNT H8]

Sorry I'm late to the party... Irish is correct I have no personal experience with the local tuners and that coupled with local tuners having no hands on with the platform makes me a tad nervous. I have been doing a ton of research and have read a ton of horrer stories, for what ever reason as sick as these motors are; they are no easy task to tune. Now is seems shops like AED, BREN, Steeda etc have the mail order tune down strong, and with a lil extra data logging they get them spot on for you! AED is probaly who I will chose, will I be leaving 10hp on the table; maybe but I'm ok with that. Driving to Livernois is a viable idea as well...

There seems to be some great knowledge here locally and I thank eveyone for thier input here. WBD is right around the corner from me too and I will deff give them my business with a base run etc. Now if they would like to volenteer thier services to mess with the platform I'd bite ; ).

These forums do their intended purpose, to share knowledge and experience!

[Josepy]

So this would be harder to tune than a FI car? What is so hard to tune about? First I have ever heard about this. Not being a dick either. Just wondering why this motor would be harder to tune than anything running spray or a turbo or blower.

[BAD LS1]

^^^ Correct, its not like tuning a space shuttle.

Dnt H8, save your self allot of time/effort. Pick a handheld with pre-loaded tune templates for the exact bolt on's you intend to install and bring it to a dyno, then make some final tweaks with the 10% adjustment windows to get it where it should be. In the case of a Ford, where they are at a unique advantage with templates, there is zero need for a "custom" tune unless its some crazy one off FI setup or similar.

[crazyhorse]

Aed are great guys. I used to live 45 minutes from their shop and have never heard any complaints from them. I took my Mach 1 up to them for a clutch install and they had it back to me right away. The shop is very clean like eat off the floor clean.

[DNT H8]

So this would be harder to tune than a FI car? What is so hard to tune about? First I have ever heard about this. Not being a dick either. Just wondering why this motor would be harder to tune than anything running spray or a turbo or blower.

Not sure my friend, this is what im able to gather from reputable forum members on corral and other sources etc... Issues with blown #8 cyl, drivability, etc after a tune from unfamiliar hands. Now have I seen this first hand No, Im a carb guy, so a lot of the in depth tuner verbage is new to me. But I can tell you from what I read this is not like tuning a typical LS motor... Im just trying to accomplish my due diligence here... Ill get you a more tangible reasons.




Dnt H8, save your self allot of time/effort. Pick a handheld with pre-loaded tune templates for the exact bolt on's you intend to install and bring it to a dyno, then make some final tweaks with the 10% adjustment windows to get it where it should be. In the case of a Ford, where they are at a unique advantage with templates, there is zero need for a "custom" tune unless its some crazy one off FI setup or similar.

Solid advice, and didnt even consider this.... Thanks Ill go this route for sure. This is an education process for me here... no jets and air bleeds lol. Of course timing and AFR is a universal concept but there is always more to learn with FI

[DNT H8]

Aed are great guys. I used to live 45 minutes from their shop and have never heard any complaints from them. The shop is very clean like eat off the floor clean.

Noted!!! Thank You

[Prince Valiant]

I am a little bit in awe on the concept that "one knows how to tune X but not Y...."

I am with Tom/Murray on this. A *good* tuner operates under principles. Change one thing and measure...understanding that the one change will likely lead changes elsewhere, and where that might be. A good tuner should be pretty methodical in their approach and should be able to obtain the best result from whatever they're tuning.

Experience *will* generally tell you that "X with A and B mods generally responds best to 34 degrees timing all in by 2600rpm and 12.4:1 AFR's/fuel tables/whatever" but that's really just a time saving device...a *good* tuner will still try different things to get a few more HP out of it.

That was always the case with old cars too...lot of people want to go to "chevy guys" or "ford guys", etc for their tuning. Because that chevy guy generally knew what the chevy's liked...a bad tuner would just apply what a chevy liked to the ford engines and of course, a customer would be dissatisfied with the results. Of all people, "Big Daddy" Don Gartlits fit this mold in his early days...he hated the 426 hemi, believing it to be a dog compared to the heavier 392 chrysler hemi's he used previously. It was out of frustration that he improved the tune when he simply cranked the distributer way advanced, some say hoping to blow the engine on a run, so he could swap back to the old chrysler engines. Found out that the 426 hemi ran MUCH better with much more advance...and immediately bested all his previous PR's first run out

He had doggedly been running 32 degrees total like he had been on the 392's previously while the 426's like 40-42 degrees total. He had simply applied what he knew the previous hemi's liked without a willingness to change, test, and repeat for best results...even though the engines were from the same manufacture and engineered by many of the same engineers, using the same basic engine layout.

One thing that experience with a make might be more useful for is knowing the limits...though again, a good tuner would start seeing the signs that they're going "too far" before hitting a danger zone in my mind.

If they were charging straight up for time, I'd go with the guy with experience everyday...but if it's a flat fee (and I believe it is), I'd have no qualms going to the guys that are simply "good tuners" if they are close vs going to timbuktu for experience w/ a particular engine.

[WhatsADSM]

So this would be harder to tune than a FI car? What is so hard to tune about? First I have ever heard about this. Not being a dick either. Just wondering why this motor would be harder to tune than anything running spray or a turbo or blower.


^^^ Correct, its not like tuning a space shuttle.

Its different and "no easy task to tune" because its got intake/exhaust cam timing, and pretty high compression. That's its biggest changes anyways.

While this is new to (exclusively) Ford v8 tuners its been around for ages in other vehicles. Nissan had dual VCT on a quad cam motor about 10 years ago. IIRC BMW had a nearly identical size/architecture (to the coyote) on their S62 motor which was available in the 1998 M5. FWIW I've tuned lots of Nissan VQs and even some VANOS equipped Bimmers (albiet not M5s) ;)

DNT does have a point in that it is different and takes more time to dial in, especially if you are really looking to get every last bit out of it. It takes me 2 times longer to properly tune something like a naturally aspirated K20 powered honda civic (with VCT and VTEC) than it does to tune a blower on GM LS. It is more time consuming, not sure if I would call it more "difficult" though.



Sorry I'm late to the party... Irish is correct I have no personal experience with the local tuners and that coupled with local tuners having no hands on with the platform makes me a tad nervous. I have been doing a ton of research and have read a ton of horrer stories, for what ever reason as sick as these motors are; they are no easy task to tune. Now is seems shops like AED, BREN, Steeda etc have the mail order tune down strong, and with a lil extra data logging they get them spot on for you! AED is probaly who I will chose, will I be leaving 10hp on the table; maybe but I'm ok with that. Driving to Livernois is a viable idea as well...

There seems to be some great knowledge here locally and I thank eveyone for thier input here. WBD is right around the corner from me too and I will deff give them my business with a base run etc. Now if they would like to volenteer thier services to mess with the platform I'd bite ; ).

These forums do their intended purpose, to share knowledge and experience!

Yea chat with WBD about it, and schedule a base run. At the least it would be cool for you to post up before/after. I would like to see how they respond. You can chat with them about volunteering to tune the engine as a learning exercise, but I wouldn't get my hopes up. Like I said there isn't anything groundbreaking in your PCM.



Dnt H8, save your self allot of time/effort. Pick a handheld with pre-loaded tune templates for the exact bolt on's you intend to install and bring it to a dyno, then make some final tweaks with the 10% adjustment windows to get it where it should be. In the case of a Ford, where they are at a unique advantage with templates, there is zero need for a "custom" tune unless its some crazy one off FI setup or similar.

I agree this is a good option. Just get a canned tuned and play around with the global handheld settings. DNT your mods sound like they are pretty close to the canned stuff, it's a MAF car, and if you don't want to do a true custom tune on a dyno some playing with a handheld and a canned tune is a valid option. Especially if you don't mind leaving a little power on the table.

[DNT H8]

Thank you ADSM for clarifying my concerns. I just plan on CAI, catless X pipe, and axlebacks. I plan to DD this car as much as possible, as I have a weekend car already. So reliability is very important over ever ounce of power, they make enough as it is ; )

[DRK]

#1 Ford tuner in the area and a great guy to deal with.

http://www.dynotunemp.com/

[STANMAN]

Thank you ADSM for clarifying my concerns. I just plan on CAI, catless X pipe, and axlebacks. I plan to DD this car as much as possible, as I have a weekend car already. So reliability is very important over ever ounce of power, they make enough as it is ; )

If that's all you are planning, going with a canned tune from any "Mustang Specialty" will be your best bet. Brenspeed has been great to me, everyone I have sent there has been equally impressed. And if you choose to add things down the line, they will update the tune to your mods free of charge (not sure if the other big name shops do that, but would assume so).

[SilverHorse]

^^^^ Yep, what he said. I had a brenspeed 91 octane tune with just exhaust and CAI and it made a huge difference. Different motor but I would expect similar results. And as for their customer service.....awesome!

[SilverHorse]

Tom does an awesome job too, I eventually upgraded to a tune from him. You won't go wrong going that route either.

[venm4u97]

why avoid marv?