Oil Leak, carb tune, etc....

[Korndogg]

Where is there a good place to get a dye kit around here? Do the usual parts places carry this? I've never used it before but I have a pretty major oil leak that I need to fix on my Camaro and I think I know where it's coming from but I want to make sure that it's the only spot where I have a leak. I might just take it somewhere and have them fix it instead of me trying to chase down a bunch of leaks and buying a dye kit.

Also my car is running rich as hell. Any time I step on it a little bit there is black smoke. I checked the plugs so I'm thinking my carb just needs to be tuned.



Any recommendations for shops to go to? Any vendors want to take a look at it?? lol

[lilws6]

Oil dye can be had most parts stores I know carquest had it and oreilly has it. Comes in a 1oz bottle

[BAD LS1]

West bend Dyno has 2 guys really good with all makes of carbs.

[Korndogg]

How good are they at fixing leaks?? haha

[Reverend Cooper]

mark if you need some oil dye stop by my work i can get some for you

[Korndogg]

Ok thanks man I'll let you know.

[Holeshot]

Mark I have dye at work and a UV light you can borrow any time. Just let me know when you want to do it and Ill bring a bottle home.

[Korndogg]

Ok thanks! I let you guys know. It may not be for a couple weeks or so before I get to it. I'm not really sure yet.

[spooln30]

I already know what most of you guys will say but if your rear main seal is the cause of the leak. Run a bottle of Bars Leak- Rear Main Sealer. I have used it in a few friends rides who just couldn't afford to fix it and they both were leaking pretty good. This shit does work and works fn great. This is one of those fix-it in a bottle deals that lives up to what the label says.

[Dr.Buick]

It's a SBC pull it and reseal it from top to bottom. can't take more than a weekend

[Cryptic]

I'm with Jim on this one. How hard could it be to pull a carb'd SBC...

[jbiscuit]

Thats the only way to fix it. Pull the motor, seal it up and toss it back in

[Korndogg]

I thought of it but if it's something easy why pull the motor?

[Wagonbacker9]

because if one seal is going, the rest aren't far behind?

[Korndogg]

The motor is only 4 years old or so. It's been leaking for 2 and now it's at the point where when I go to the Dells carshow, I go through a quart of oil. That's why I'm thinking when the motor was built, something didn't seal properly and finally let loose.

[Wagonbacker9]

I retract my statment then. lol

[Korndogg]

Not that I won't pull the motor and reseal everything. I just think if it's an easy fix, why do all that for nothing? Plus it would be nice to see what's been leaking anyway.

[Lash]

This has to be the first time that a fitter is surprised that something he built is leaking. :D

[Korndogg]

Every day you make me wish more and more I never worked with you haha

[jbiscuit]

can you figure out the general area the oil is coming from? Granted it IS a SBC and they leak pretty much everywhere anyways but still. LOL. Could be something simple to fix like you said

[Korndogg]

I tried that...that's why I'm just going to try out the dye

[Ricky Bobby]

why the fuck pull the motor unless its the rear main seal and the motor is 4yrs old with 1000miles on it shit mine is 6yrs old but doesnt leak except for the carb should I pull mine also

[jbiscuit]

Sounds like he has several leaks. Might be the best way to seal everything up

[Ricky Bobby]

well mark find the leak first then we'll decide if we need to disassemble

[Korndogg]

Forgot about this thread lol. Just wanted to say, it was shitty valve covers......

[Irish]

Lol

[Korndogg]

good thing i didn't pull my engine!!! haha

[Prince Valiant]

here's the thing though, even though it's just the valve covers, it could still be a secondary leak due to high crankcase pressure...though if I remember, you vent it quite well. There aren't other signs that something is amiss is there? Like the dipstick keeps getting blown off the tube, etc?

[Korndogg]

yes, my dipstick does keep getting blown off. I was thinking my rings were shot because of the oil pissing out of my valve cover and also the dipstick getting blown off. I have a breather on each cover so I would think that would be enough to get rid of any pressure if there wasn't blow-by. But would that be causing the huge amounts of black smoke?

I locked my other thread but this is what I posted in it if you didn't see.

Ok well the exhaust is still black as hell. I had it tuned at WBD last year and that didnt change my exhaust color at all. They said all the numbers are right where they should be so im lost.... It looks like im rolling coal ffs and when im idling, deposits come ou of the tailpipes and get all over eveything. Any ideas?

I haven't had much money to work on it in the past couple years but I want to fix this. Its kind of embarrassing lol...

[Prince Valiant]

Black and not blue grey makes me think it's not oil getting by the rings, but the fact that you are apparently getting so much blow-by makes me think it's worth pulling and taking it apart for inspection.

Hopefully given that there is not too much wear-n-tear/miles, you could at worst get away with re-honing the block, new rings, gaskets, etc, put it back together and go...and probably be much better off. Something like this could probably be done for less than 400 dollars total, and won't have the fresh start break-in hassles of a new engine if you reuse the cam/lifters.

[Korndogg]

Should I do a compression or leak down test to see what I'm dealing with before I do anything? My issue is I don't have a compressor yet at my new house so I'm kind of screwed when it comes to that. I suppose I could borrow my dad's though. But I still don't have testers either.

I guess I don't understand how blow-by could cause black smoke though?

[Prince Valiant]

I don't know that it can...it's just that the amount of crankcase pressure strongly suggest that whatever the cause of the black smoke, you have an issue that needs addressing.

Doing a leak-down test would be instructive, but ultimately an academic endeavor; there are enough signs suggesting you need to re-ring the beast. I still say doing an easy compression test could give you an idea of what you're looking at as well...less in terms of "how are my rings" and more "are there any other changes I may need to pursue?" while you're in there.

Fixing the known problem may or may not address the black smoke. It couldn't hurt.

[Korndogg]

Yeah I suppose I could just pull it and look at everything. Time to get a propane heater for the garage!

[jbiscuit]

Do you have a choke on the carb? Have you verified its not sticking shut? Verified the float adjustment is correct?

[Korndogg]

I'm going to double check everything tomorrow and also do a compression test. I paid wbd $400 to make sure my car was tuned properly so I would hope my shit is in order.....

[jbiscuit]

You need to verify some basic stuff before you pull the motor apart. Black Smoke is rich condition. So what causes that? Could be float too high, choke stuck shut, blown power valve in the carb etc. It smokes at idle and on the gas? But WBD tuned it? Was it doing this when you picked it up after they tuned it?

[Korndogg]

It smokes all the time no matter what. It smoked before and after it was tuned.

[stenchmiester]

mark i have a leak down and compression tester i cpuld lend u till monday

[Korndogg]

Compression test went well. 190 psi was the average and they were all within 5 psi of eachother.

Here is a picture of the plugs just for the hell of it.

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/792161_581956215048_1963562406_o.jpg

[Irish]

Top row, plug #3, is that one wet compared to the others?

[Korndogg]

It wasn't wet but I havent ran the engine in a while. It was darker and not whitish like the rest though.

[SSDude]

Top row, plug #3, is that one wet compared to the others?
Ditto on the number three plug doesn't look to be firing properly. All the other plugs look to be rich. Besides some jetting work you might need to go up one heat range and back out a couple degrees of timing.

I did stay at a Holiday Inn once.

[Korndogg]

Well im going to get rid of this piece of shit edelbrock that almost killed me last year. So im guessing the black smoke is due to my carb then.....I dont know what else it could be.

[73MACH]

Holley FTW!

[Korndogg]

Thats the plan lol. Does that sound right though? I mean it has to be the carb. I dont know what else it could be. The black exhaust is coming from both sides. If that's the case, ill be ordering a holley tomorrow. Any one specific? I havent looked at their carbs in a while.


Also makes me wonder how it was tuned like this?

[Ricky Bobby]

Thank god that carb is goin away!



As for it being in afr is beyond me considering the thing looks like a big rig when under acceleration or even idle still puffs black smoke.

[jbiscuit]

Hard to tell the color of the plugs because the flash washes them out but like the other guys pointed out, something looks off with that #3 plug top row. IE weak spark, not firing something. Too much total timing also. Have you out a timing light on it? I'd guess that thing has close to 40 degrees all in

[Korndogg]

They are white. And no I havent had a light on it since after they tuned it.

[jbiscuit]

Went back and looked at your plugs some more. They actually look to me like you are running rich at idle but you don't have much color on the porcelain so Id say you could be running lean WOT. (Too much timing and/or jetting). The ground strap shows a lot of timing for sure.

[jbiscuit]

They are white.
Bingo

[Korndogg]

So I guess a new carb and a little bit of adjusting and hopefully I'll be good?

[Korndogg]

Here is the dyno sheet with my AFR on it.

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/405058_559851433208_212700885_31353214_1508078318_ n.jpg

[Ricky Bobby]

32-34 all in is what a lot of people say for sbc u have a adjustable light or fixed?

[Korndogg]

It's adjustable.

[Ricky Bobby]

Cool

[SSDude]

Re-jet the Eddy

[jbiscuit]

Still curious about that one plug not looking like the others.

[SSDude]

Still curious about that one plug not looking like the others.
Bad wire or plug you'd have a noticeable miss.

[Korndogg]

Re-jet the Eddy


Nope, I'm done with them since it almost killed me and my wife last year.

[Ricky Bobby]

Not to mention could have really hurt the motor.

[jbiscuit]

Bad wire or plug you'd have a noticeable miss.

Correct. The air-fuel actually looks pretty good. Hmm. The plugs suggest a little lean however tho that could be from cruise. Perhaps that's a bit lean. The plug wires in good shape? No cuts or anything in them specifically the wire for that cylinder? What about the cap?

[Korndogg]

Wires are fine. I'll take another look tomorrow. I didn't look at anything with the ignition yet. I did my compression test and was done for the day. I understand the one plug possibly being an issue but wtf is with all of the black smoke if the afr looks fine?

For the record, I have and MSD HEI distributor with a 6al box.

[Korndogg]

Another thing is, if my compression test turned out fine, I shouldn't really have crankcase pressure, especially with my two breathers correct? So how was oil spraying out of my old valve covers and my dipstick popping up?

[wikked]

So how was oil spraying out of my old valve covers and my dipstick popping up?

It magically turns into a 4g63 when you close the hood?

[Prince Valiant]

Another thing is, if my compression test turned out fine, I shouldn't really have crankcase pressure, especially with my two breathers correct? So how was oil spraying out of my old valve covers and my dipstick popping up?Because racecar.

You DO have high crankcase pressure...there really is no doubt on that. It's VERY possible to have good compression test results and crummy leakdown results. Tom has talked many times about this occurrence.

BUT the compression test was VERY instructive here...surprised with the results actually. Essentially that is a very stout bottom end. More cylinder pressure than I would have expected with those large chambered heads...but that's good, it says the basic parts are there to work very well imo.

If you've got access to the leakdown tester, try running that. If you're seeing 25-30 percent or more, then be plan on redoing it. If you don't, try a PCV valve routed to the rear vacuum port on your carb...the vacuum will actually help end the leaking valve covers/blowing of dipstick.

With the fairly high stall TC and decent gears you've got in that light car, maybe ask around if it's feasible to do a mechanical carb...much better throttle response. Fuel mileage and low rpm cruising w/ the OD trans is no longer a concern anymore as it was when specifying the carb, so why not go with the one that could give you the best power? Like I said...ask around. If you had a 4500rpm stall TC, 4.10 gears in a light little nova, I'd say do it, no doubt. But you're definitely closer to still wanting a vacuum secondary...but I don't think it's beyond the scope of plausibility to suggest you could probably do a mechanical secondary either...

[Josepy]

Just rip the fucking motor out and get it fixed already. There problem solved.

[Korndogg]

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-1RkWPoTTVm4/T3vXjKqUlwI/AAAAAAAAANs/0ghBjlikD80/s1600/why-you-mad-tho1.jpg

[Josepy]

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-1RkWPoTTVm4/T3vXjKqUlwI/AAAAAAAAANs/0ghBjlikD80/s1600/why-you-mad-tho1.jpg

LOL I am not mad. Burn the fucker to the ground. That is what old camaros are good for. Bwaahhhhhh

[Korndogg]

You're drunk aren't you.....lol

[Josepy]

You're drunk aren't you.....lol

LOL Surprisingly not at all. Actually at work fixing some laptops.

[Korndogg]

Well then just fuck you then....hahaha

[BAD LS1]

Some engines do pour black smoke at wot though the afr says otherwise. Not sure why that happens, could be two of the same kinda vehicles, one will do it, other not so much. Sounds like the lack of power made too is being over looked?

[jbiscuit]

I haven't forgotten that point either Tommy. This thing is waaaay down on power. That one plug is either not firing or intermittently firing...which would contribute to the lack of hp obviously. Miss mistaken for lumpy cam perhaps lol

[Moparjim]

Agree with Prince, you obviously have blow by. Leak down test will confirm. Probably some sort of issue like bad rings with whatever cylinder had the wet looking plug in it. Really nothing else will make your dipstick blow out, not to mention the oil leaks, smoke, other symptoms.

[Korndogg]

http://cache.ohinternet.com/images/e/e6/Okay_guy.jpg


Well I guess I'll start tearing it down tonight if I have time. Otherwise this week for sure. I'll probably have a ton more questions since this is only the second time I've done this lol.

Where should I take the block and what should I have done to it?


Also Tom, I didn't forget about the lack of power, I just thought maybe it would have been carb related. This thing idles with black smoke. Either way though, I'm getting a new carb no matter what I do.

[Korndogg]

Just for fun. Lets come up with some (reasonable) ideas that I could do while I have this thing apart. For instance, I thought about lowering the compression and eventually throwing a supercharger on it. I'm getting rid of the Eddy carb no matter what.

Who knows, maybe I'll end up changing stuff up.

Here's what I have now.

383 stroker

10.5 compression

Lunati Cam - Duration - 276/284, Lift - .504/.525

AFR 195 Street heads 74cc

Edelbrock 750

1.5 Comp Gold rockers

Ohio Crankshaft 4340 3.75" crank

6" H-beam rods

SRP flat top pistons.

[Prince Valiant]

Still say do the leakdown...don't rebuild unless you get over 20% leakdown on one of the cylinders. Nothing hurt by seeing what you've got.

[Prince Valiant]

Just for fun. Lets come up with some (reasonable) ideas that I could do while I have this thing apart.
As for the "for fun" ideas, I'd consider getting a bigger cam.

Let's not forget, the cam selected was supposed to work with a vehicle utilizing a lower stall torque converter and a 2.39:1 final drive ratio (0.7:1 of the OD trans w/ 3.42 rear). The carb was too (eddy's in general have far better tuneability for part/low throttle settings)...and since you now have a decent stall T/C and three speed non-od trans, might as well loose the remnants of your current engine that were specified for those narrow objectives. Bigger cam, more serious carb...though either way, it may be wise to consider going to a deeper rear end in the future...3.90+ gears would work best.

But even with the 3.42's and the loose T/C, you should be able to be pretty happy with something in the 240-244 range duration @ .050, sticking with a HYD flat-tappet cam. Keeping the LSA narrow too around 108-110, no more...

[Wagonbacker9]

LS swap.

Tehe.

[Josepy]

LS swap.

Tehe.


I have been trying to get him to do this.

[xxtremeteam]

LS swap.

Tehe.

Best idea might as well get a t56 at the same time

[Lash]

ls swap.

Tehe.

x2

Just get it over with already.

[Prince Valiant]

kind of think he was looking for cheap, lol :D

[jbiscuit]

It doesn't need an ls motor. That's giving up. He just needs to fix what's wrong and his 383 should run great and make a ton of hp with those heads etc

[Korndogg]

I was actually thinking about putting a bigger cam in it. I was also thinking about having someone do a custom grind.


I'm going to do a lead down as soon as I get a compressor at my house. I'm going to hopefully borrow my dad's tomorrow.

[Irish]

Doing an engine swap is not cheap but would be very cool.

Cammed LQ4 (with a/c ;) ) T-56, 4.10 gears.

That would be fun annnnnd you'd have a different (newer) platform to build from!

I wonder what it would cost you if you went the budget route?

[Prince Valiant]

I'm going to do a lead down as soon as I get a compressor at my house.
Probably could reasonably cheaply get your current cam reground....150-300 bucks usually. Feed an old hand cam grinder your current specs and he'll probably come up with a good set of specs for you. You'd need to buy a new set of lifters too (70-100 bucks) to go with the cost.

But there are plenty of off-the shelf cam AND lifter kits that will also get you what you want for 200 shipped to your door.

[Korndogg]

Yeah.. just ideas lol.

[Prince Valiant]

And of course, another option is just getting the blow-by issue fixed as cheaply/easily as possible and get it back together....get a new carb and see where you're at. You can always re-do the cam at a later date, and it saves the hassle of rebreaking in the cam when you start her up for the first time. Less hassle NOW and less worries. Then getting the cam you want in the future....

[Korndogg]

I just figured since I was taking everything apart anyway, I would upgrade it a bit.

[Prince Valiant]

Where should I take the block and what should I have done to it?Go to a couple places and tell them what's going on...swing by C&S and others, tell them you're looking what to do on a budget, how few miles, etc and get a couple quotes. The issue to focus on will be the blow-by (leaky valve covers, dipstick)...they won't give a rat's ass about the black smoke, and if you focus too much on that, they'll tell you its a tuning issue.

The cheapest way out is disassemble, have it honed, and then reassemble yourself. But the BETTER, and typically not terribly too much more would be take it to them for disassembly, honing, and reassembly. Probably save yourself a few bucks by just taking the short block to them and having them reassemble the short block too. If you reuse the cam, probably save a few bucks right there...don't forget, you'll probably pick up a good bit of power just by dealing with the blow-by issue and new carb.

Even though it may be cheaper do do as much yourself, you'll probably come out ahead by having a pro in a clean room assemble it. That's what I did for my short-block, had them degree the cam too...turned out great.

[Prince Valiant]

Another possibility is to enroll in a class at MATC.

Friend of mine does this seemingly every year. Class doesn't cost a lot, you get to use the latest machining equipment, have a pro help out, etc. The only downside is that it takes a while because it's one night a week. But you bench start it, etc, and it'll be ready to get back in the car by early May.

[Josepy]

Another possibility is to enroll in a class at MATC.

Friend of mine does this seemingly every year. Class doesn't cost a lot, you get to use the latest machining equipment, have a pro help out, etc. The only downside is that it takes a while because it's one night a week. But you bench start it, etc, and it'll be ready to get back in the car by early May.

Pshh who has time for all that crap?
e5MZcxZdZdw

[73MACH]

Pshh who has time for all that crap?
e5MZcxZdZdw

Wait...isn't that how everybody pulls their motor?? No wonder it kept costing me so much.


:goof

[Prince Valiant]

Get the heads off yet? What did you see?

[Korndogg]

Im not taking the heads off. Jim is.

[Korndogg]

Engine was fucked from the beginning. I'm lucky shit didn't break from the start. I'll let Jim explain more if he feels he wants to. I could have had a supercharged/turbo motor with all the money I'm putting back into this thing. Should have just did it right from the start and had someone that knew what the fuck they were doing build the engine.

I'm trying to be really fucking calm right now so I'm just going to try to forget about it for the weekend and go get drunk.

[Irish]

Engine was fucked from the beginning. I'm lucky shit didn't break from the start. I'll let Jim explain more if he feels he wants to. I could have had a supercharged/turbo motor with all the money I'm putting back into this thing. Should have just did it right from the start and had someone that knew what the fuck they were doing build the engine.

I'm trying to be really fucking calm right now so I'm just going to try to forget about it for the weekend and go get drunk.

Who built it originally? Who is going to build it for you now?

[jbiscuit]

WOW. This is going to get good.

[-stew-]

[QUOTE=Josepy;747355]Pshh who has time for all that crap??


Guy at work tried removing a tailgate that way at work. Or maybe he was trying to remove the crane from the ceiling, I'm not sure; but it didn't go well.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2

[DR.FORD]

Short and sweet-
you need oil ring spacers with this design piston, not that moving the oil rings up and down in the groove wouldn't have given a clue. Oh, and you don't put orange silicone on the rear main parting halves to make sure the oil passage seals. It tends to plug the hole when you torque it down.
Making sure that the rocker slots clear the studs helps too, but I knew that was not checked when I installed the roller rockers.

[Korndogg]

And there it is lol. Thanks for the call today. Sorry I didnt pick up. I was ice fishing. If you need anything else let me know.

[Lash]

WOW. This is going to get good.

Yeah it is...lol.

[BAD LS1]

Did you find anything definitive causing the crankcase pressure that was pushing all the oil out? Incl the dipstick? The oil ring issue would cause a bunch consumption one would guess but blow by must be pretty strong with this one?

[Prince Valiant]

Yeah, I'm still confused as to why the high crank pressure was occurring and why the one plug looked like it wasn't firing? As for the oil rings, I recall mark using the supplied parts, including all the rings that came with his kit...was the lack of spacers with these pistons an oversight on the kit supplier?

[Irish]

So did Mark build the engine? I am confused.

[jbiscuit]

I thought Mark had some help putting it together?

[Ricky Bobby]

yes mark had help putting it together

[Prince Valiant]

So is anybody trying to insinuate something?

Yep, I helped Mark...because no one else was offering. I didn't pretend to be an expert, only somone who had done it once before...

[Irish]

So is anybody trying to insinuate something?

Yep, I helped Mark...because no one else was offering. I didn't pretend to be an expert, only somone who had done it once before...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/10/ave2udug.jpg

[Irish]

http://youtu.be/K8E_zMLCRNg

[jbiscuit]

:popcorn

[Wagonbacker9]

Spring is almost here...

[Irish]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/12/dutema7u.jpg

[DR.FORD]

So is anybody trying to insinuate something?

I didn't pretend to be an expert
How about we all let that soak in for a while...

[Prince Valiant]

How about we all let that soak in for a while...Or why don't you just say it?

I don't think you know what you think you know :)

[DR.FORD]

Five rod bearings installed backwards, grinding on the crank chamfer also.
To explain the crankcase pressure issues-
when the top ring (compression) and the second ring (scraper) are overwhelmed with oil, they cannot seat. Then add that the rings were eventually washed out by over-fueling, that was the dagger.
Blame can be placed on the guy that put the parts in the kit, but it doesn't explain the lack of "common sense" that the oil ring package flopped around in the ring groove.
It WILL have a pcv system in it also.
This engine had a great cam-head combo and made 300 to the rear tires. Something wrong here?!!

[DR.FORD]

I have done this for a living for over 30 years.
My customer cars and my personal cars' performance speak for themselves.
I am human and have made mistakes.
I DON'T answer everyones automotive questions on internet threads then backpedal when I was clearly wrong or didn't use my head.
I don't consider myself a regular "know it all".
And finally, I don't care what you think, because I have experienced first-hand your lack of knowledge- at least in engine assembly.
You seem to have convinced yourself that because you can look up textbook answers to technical questions, that you can transfer that to your hands and assemble an engine correctly.
I have always believed that if you give someone enough rope, well......
unfortunately you are not the only one that got hanged.

[paul69 chevelle]

you mean to tell me the rod bearing chamfer is suppose to face the crank journal fillet!!?? ...........dawg gummit lol

[-stew-]

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f226/PsychoPsonic/Fark/ForestFireLikeWhereThisThreadIsGoin.jpg

[Prince Valiant]

This engine had a great cam-head combo and made 300 to the rear tires. Something wrong here?!!It is a great head/cam combo...especially would have worked well for its original purpose. But clearly you believe I am to blame for Mark's engine :)

And I'm sure you're not alone in that or come to that conclusion by yourself...


Five rod bearings installed backwards, grinding on the crank chamfer also.
To explain the crankcase pressure issues-
when the top ring (compression) and the second ring (scraper) are overwhelmed with oil, they cannot seat. Then add that the rings were eventually washed out by over-fueling, that was the dagger.
Blame can be placed on the guy that put the parts in the kit, but it doesn't explain the lack of "common sense" that the oil ring package flopped around in the ring groove.
It WILL have a pcv system in it also.
Which all shows an inexperienced builder...nor would it have been improved on if I was the only builder.

Here's the thing, I resent the insinuation that this is *my fault.* It's not that I am totally blameless, since I certainly helped....but:

1. My first offer to help was simply put together a recipe of parts that would work well for the goals he had.

2. Mark wanted to build it himself, and my original intent was NOT to help in that endeavor...figuring he would be better served by any number of more experienced guys. It was unfortunate that the help never materialized in the way he needed it to.

3. One of my first suggestions was to take it to a shop and have someone build the shortblock and go from there. Spoke of the advantages of having someone who *knows* what they are doing and does it *all the time* put it together for you...in a clean room and all the proper tools to boot. Yet Mark's desire was to build it himself.

4. Given the direction he wanted to go, and still in need of help (and with plenty of reservations of my own knowing the shortcomings and risk and having VOICED them) went and purchased a book stating that we'd do the best we can following those directions to a "T" really not straying from it at all. That's right...purchased a BOOK...not the stuff of grandiose expertise.

---it's with that that I am still somewhat surprised that 5 rod bearings were installed incorrectly...I cannot recall if I was there to help with all eight, but taking great care in the ones we did to make sure all bearings were placed correctly per the instructions. Just as we had done with installing the rings, oil and otherwise. I do not recall what you speak of in terms of the oil rings "flop[ping] around" in there groove so I can't recall what in your words should have been obvious or not...all I can say was that we followed the given directions using the supplied parts and nothing seemed untoward at that time, meaning that I recall that the oil rings moved freely, but no necessarily flopping around in it's groove.

5. On the issues involving the rockers, *again* I pleaded ignorance. Familiar with mopar shaft mounted rockers, not pedestal mounted rockers I advised Mark to get someone with experience (even if he had to PAY them) to measure correct length push-rods (I had no experience doing so) and adjusting them, since I was clueless...again, no help was forthcoming, tried best as I could to help Mark.

To try and put this in perspective, more than once I told Mark not tell people I'm "building" or even much helping. I didn't want "shout outs" or anything that would give me credit I thought was undue. Success of not, I stressed that this was his baby through and through. All I could claim was to help him with things that were relatively simple and hope better help would come along at the tough spots. I made what I thought the best recommendations, and followed or not, lead us to here.

[Prince Valiant]

I DON'T answer everyones automotive questions on internet threads then backpedal when I was clearly wrong or didn't use my headUm, but you do state blatant untruths :rolleyes:

[Ricky Bobby]

Now we wait for the novel response.


Ah crap 2 min late lol

[Prince Valiant]

Now we wait for the novel response.


Ah crap 2 min late lolDetailed...hardly even column lengthed.

[Wagonbacker9]

LS engine.

That is all.

[DR.FORD]

What is untrue?
As far as your response, the ONLY thing I see as not "back pedalling" is the fact that experience and expertise beats reading a "book".
Keep reaching for BS, it is entertaining.
I will go as far to say that helping a friend is great, and if there are mess-ups, you still tried to help.
Your arrogance and "know it all" attitude is what put your tit in the ringer.
If ANYONE wants to confirm these FACTS, call Clint at C&S who is performing the necessary machine work 262-781-0469.
Oh, and BTW, you might want to update your computer- in ANY engine when you install main studs, you align hone the block.....

[DR.FORD]

LS engine.

That is all.

They too have rings, rod bearings, etc. that need to be installed correctly.

[Prince Valiant]

What is untrue?"...answer everyones automotive questions on internet ..."

Um, yah...I don't :)


As far as your response, the ONLY thing I see as not "back pedalling" Your arrogance and "know it all" attitude is what put your tit in the ringer.Oh, I know I'm held to a higher standard. I don't mind...

That said, I still stand by the events as I told them. If anyone says I was the builder or pretended to know everything during the build or otherwise, they're wrong.

Oh, and BTW, you might want to update your computer- in ANY engine when you install main studs, you align hone the block.....Um, I know. Mark bought the block pre-machined and had it "checked out" by his girlfriend (now wifes) dad. But, if I am to blame for *everything* that's wrong....then that's on me too I guess.

[DR.FORD]

You seem to have skipped over the "arrogance" and "know it all" attitude comment.
THAT is the only standard I hold you to....

[Ricky Bobby]

I would have helped by telling him take it in and not continue the build its only gonna screw u in the end. Friend or not I would have walked since I wouldn't have wanted my name anywhere near it. Help here was convincing him to take it in and not touching a wrench and not building a stroker motor out of a "book".

[BAD LS1]

Purely because I enjoy engine failure analysis... Can we get pics of the rings and cylinder walls if any were taken?

[Prince Valiant]

You seem to have skipped over the "arrogance" and "know it all" attitude comment.
THAT is the only standard I hold you to....Well, it's because you think these things of me, you therefore hold me to a higher standard, hoping to gloat if I fail, for real or not. Trust me, I get it...nor does it bug me.


I would have helped by telling him take it in and not continue the build its only gonna screw u in the end. Friend or not I would have walked since I wouldn't have wanted my name anywhere near it. Help here was convincing him to take it in and not touching a wrench and not building a stroker motor out of a "book".Hindsight being perfect, yep...should have been what I should have done. He didn't know better, and I should have.

[Irish]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/12/6emebety.jpg

[DR.FORD]

Well, it's because you think these things of me, you therefore hold me to a higher standard, hoping to gloat if I fail, for real or not. Trust me, I get it...nor does it bug me.
Well, that is the arrogant way of looking at it, but it couldn't be farther from the truth.
The truth is that I do not hold you to a high standard. I think that you are arrogant, you believe that you "know it all" because you give text book answers to everything to feed your need for attention, acceptance and self worth, and I find pleasure in the fact that I am correct in my thoughts.
Thank you for confirming this.

[Prince Valiant]

I think that you are arrogant, you believe that you "know it all" because you give text book answers to everything to feed your need for attention, acceptance and self worth, and I find pleasure in the fact that I am correct in my thoughts.In my personal defense (not to you though) I am tired of the tripe I "think I know it all"; believe me, anyone who knows me knows that's far from true. There is a lot I certainly do know...and I also willingly share that there is a lot I don't know. Hell, the biggest part of my job is ensure that the things I don't know is accounted for and covered.

As far as what *you* think of some random dude that you don't know on the internets, I could care less. Think whatever you like :)

[Korndogg]

Well this escalated quickly.

My father-in-law had nothing to do with the block, so don't bring him into this.

I've thanked you for the help tons of times and I still appreciate it since nobody else really wanted to help. Back then I thought you knew more about it all since you knew what I all needed and it seemed as though you knew what you were doing and continued to help me. I THOUGHT everything was right because I've never built one before and you seemed to know what you were doing. I remember a couple times when you said you weren't sure on some things but then you looked it up and we did it that way.


When it comes down to it, it's my fault for trying to build it myself. I'm not blaming you for everything but you could have easily said that you were over your head and to just take it somewhere instead of continuing to help. Overall it's just a shitty situation.

I really don't know what to think at this point and honestly I just want my engine the way it was meant to be for once.

[PureSound15]

This is frustrating to read.

One side:

I think it's the intent of this board that we all help each other where we can. Chris' personality and or like/dislike or his character aside - he tried to help and that's more than what I, personally, could have done regarding the construction of a motor.

But:

I also understand the frustration of (literally) disastrous help, fault aside. We've all tried to do things on a budget or put our own sweat into a car and this time it ended up not being worth it.

Either way it'll be nice when Mark's car makes some great power.

[jbiscuit]

If that motor made 300whp hurt and running like shit it is gonna be a monster when it's put back together correctly. Mark is a good guy. Looking forward the 2nd go-round of his 383. Better watch out tho Mark, Jim might try and paint a big inch Ford motor Chevy orange :)

[Prince Valiant]

My father-in-law had nothing to do with the block, so don't bring him into this.Sorry, My mistake. I just recalled that you had him do some measurements related to the stuff you had, block included. If I misremembered, my bad. That said, I had nothing to do with studs in the block...and Jim, every block of mine that has had studs installed has been aligned honed :)


But there were plenty of times I said I didn't know and suggested help (even specifically mentioning to pay ron for help with the valvetrain)...left with none, I felt obligated to give it my best shot. My mistake...though I thought we got it right. This is also why I would read it, you would read it, then we'd do it. I don't want it to seem as if I was pulling anything out of thin air.

Though I am still confused on the rod bearing alignment, since I recall being meticulous every step of the way and I'm fairly certain I was there for all 8 cylinders, and that was one thing we paid close attention to.

[Lash]

Yeah... I'm interested/excited to see what his motor puts down in a few months.

[Ricky Bobby]

Few months few weeks :)


Hoping to take to automation

[Korndogg]

I'm most likely going to start a new thread for this lol. The block will be done in a couple weeks. And what do you mean HOPING to take it to automotion? lol

[Ricky Bobby]

K no hope it will be goin lol.

[Korndogg]

It WILL be going to Automotion.

[kevcuda]

Franklin Automotive will take care of you 76th Ryan. Bruce is the man.

[Korndogg]

Franklin Automotive will take care of you 76th Ryan. Bruce is the man.

OK I'll tell Jim to take my engine over there ASAP!










it's on 27th and Ryan btw..

[kevcuda]

How is the project going?

[Korndogg]

The heads are back at Jim's. Just waiting on the block to get back.

I'm going to be updating in my newer thread when I have something to update.