Remember this story?

[Lash]

Update on the biker shot in the back by the cop.


http://abclocal.go.com/wtvg/story?section=news/local&id=7433661

[awsomeears]

Yikes.............. !

You know its easy to point fingers and what not but split second thinking he could have had a gun while turning like that, then again not.

Not sure witch way this one will go, sad stuff !

[hrsp]

again shows why being a cop is so hard...

[VroomPshhTsi]

Yeah, honestly from the video I did not see any quick movement that looked hostile or like he was reaching for a gun. To me the cop was ready to shoot from the second he pulled him over (which I know they are trained to do, but still). If I was on the jury I'd side with the man who is now paralyzed, he stopped when the lights came on and just sat there. I usually side with the police on these matters because it usually involves a criminal who is obviously fleeing, but this is definitely not the case.

[lit666]

idiot never should have taken off in the first place.

[Mr Twigbert]

Yeah, honestly from the video I did not see any quick movement that looked hostile or like he was reaching for a gun. To me the cop was ready to shoot from the second he pulled him over (which I know they are trained to do, but still). If I was on the jury I'd side with the man who is now paralyzed, he stopped when the lights came on and just sat there. I usually side with the police on these matters because it usually involves a criminal who is obviously fleeing, but this is definitely not the case.

He pulls over and is watching the other cop pull over his buddy. But then he turns, looks at the cop (called target acquision on the cop or to look where you are going to shoot), and then push up on his legs and start to go for something in his right pocket area /waist band area.

We had a slightly different view because the squad cam is prob 3 feet to the right where the cop was probably outside of his door. That 3 ft could let us see something he wasn't able to.

I think it's sad but he wasn't trying to murder the guy. I think people are human and make bad decisions at time. But this one I think he made a 'reasonable' decision.

Just a few weeks ago we had a memo read at roll call for over a week about motorcycle gangs and that they are often armed. It's not just 40 year old factory workers riding Harleys. There are some bad mofo's on these things. AND they are in Milwaukee too.

[Silver350]

Eh This one is a tough call. I think the jury will side with the motorcyclist then the cop.

[BR3W CITY]

Sure Twigbert, Milwaukee has Outlaws heavily, HA are trying to gain ground but not much, and the Trogs (or something like that) I've seen in the area.

[Mr Twigbert]

I think the guy has a right to sue sure. But criminal charges? That's a bit much IMO. For all we know these guts were known to be in a cycle gang and violent. For all we know someone reported two guys on cycles that were waiving a gun around and the cops were dispatched. For all we know the cop stopped them for ONLY speeding. And with out audio we may not be hearing the cop yelling to see his hands. Or might not hear the cop yelling "I'm going to kill you because I ride a Rick rocket".

I dunno. But now that some time has past I can talk about the fact that I shot someone on the job that I was chasing. Ended up he didn't have a weapon. But on that day, at that time, I thought I was about to die. And for me the system worked and all turned out fine. I never met the guy before. I didn't want to hurt him. But with all that took place at that time I made the decision to fire. Glad I didn't have to go through what this cop is going through.

Wish him luck though.

[STANMAN]

He pulls over and is watching the other cop pull over his buddy. But then he turns, looks at the cop (called target acquision on the cop or to look where you are going to shoot), and then push up on his legs and start to go for something in his right pocket area /waist band area.

We had a slightly different view because the squad cam is prob 3 feet to the right where the cop was probably outside of his door. That 3 ft could let us see something he wasn't able to.

I think it's sad but he wasn't trying to murder the guy. I think people are human and make bad decisions at time. But this one I think he made a 'reasonable' decision.

Just a few weeks ago we had a memo read at roll call for over a week about motorcycle gangs and that they are often armed. It's not just 40 year old factory workers riding Harleys. There are some bad mofo's on these things. AND they are in Milwaukee too.


What Seann said. Turning like that, pulling the jacket to the back with your right hand while going into the waistband would be a classic weak draw from a crossdraw holstered weapon that someone on a horse (or a bike in this instance) would wear.


Think to, you're the officer. These clowns see you, everything is fine, then they attempt to flee from a stop sign before you even flip on the cherries and berries. That instantly puts you on high alert, and then this clown decides he's going to pull a sweep/draw motion. I think in the same situation I would have done the exact same thing as the officer. At the end of the day, my life>his, it's just that simple.

[Force4]

From the left side of the squad car the officer cant see the guys arm (at least from what I can see). He must have jumped the gun when the guy turned his head back. poor dude.

[pOrk]

Anyone that rides a motorcycle knows that the move the guy made on the bike is 100% natural, the most comfortable way to see behind you is to twist at the lower back while resting your arm on your leg. With the sirens going and the noise of the bikes, he probably turned so he could see / attempt to hear what the officer was saying. Without knowing if they were running from the cops, or racing each other and the cop happened to be behind them, I would say I think the cop jumped the gun. There was no pistol in sight, and it happened WAY to fast for him to have a valid reason to pull his piece.

Then again, maybe they were looking for these guys and there was some sort of flee attempt that we are missing. I doubt it.

[nismodave]

Supid on BOTH parties.

Dude should not of ran.

But alot of Cops seem to be getting trigger happy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uIQAnP9cQA

[STANMAN]

Anyone that rides a motorcycle knows that the move the guy made on the bike is 100% natural, the most comfortable way to see behind you is to twist at the lower back while resting your arm on your leg. With the sirens going and the noise of the bikes, he probably turned so he could see / attempt to hear what the officer was saying. Without knowing if they were running from the cops, or racing each other and the cop happened to be behind them, I would say I think the cop jumped the gun. There was no pistol in sight, and it happened WAY to fast for him to have a valid reason to pull his piece.

Then again, maybe they were looking for these guys and there was some sort of flee attempt that we are missing. I doubt it.

Watch the whole vid, they were driving normal at 1st, get to a stop sign and race off trying to evade, then the other bike jumps a curve and almost wipes out. Then the shooting happens.

[Lash]

Supid on BOTH parties.

Dude should not of ran.

But alot of Cops seem to be getting trigger happy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uIQAnP9cQA

How did he run? You are assuming that he knew the cop was behind him at the stop sign. He pulled over as soon as the cop hit the lights. It was his buddy who was the jackass.

Edit:

After another look....it appears that the guy only stopped because of the second cop that appeared at the intersection. They did keep it hammered down for a bit after the lights.

[Silver350]

That is the messed up thing about the video no audio so who knows if the Police officer was yelling get off the bike and lay on the ground. Or maybe because this guy was getting pulled over because he just beat his wife and kid to a pulp and that is why the officer was going after him.


Dash came shows the guy was just sitting like all motorcyclist do when they are at a stop.

However if I was the officer I would of thought he was reaching for a weapon and would of probably shot the guy on the bike also.

[pOrk]

Lights weren't on ( that I saw ) until they hammered it, looks like a race between friends from the dash cam. Harleys are big fat slow turds, and their stopping power is limited hence them not pulling over right away.

Who trys to evade on a hardly? lol

[VroomPshhTsi]

idiot never should have taken off in the first place.

The guy that got shot didn't try to evade, once he saw the lights he stopped and sat there.

[VroomPshhTsi]

What Seann said. Turning like that, pulling the jacket to the back with your right hand while going into the waistband would be a classic weak draw from a crossdraw holstered weapon that someone on a horse (or a bike in this instance) would wear.


Think to, you're the officer. These clowns see you, everything is fine, then they attempt to flee from a stop sign before you even flip on the cherries and berries. That instantly puts you on high alert, and then this clown decides he's going to pull a sweep/draw motion. I think in the same situation I would have done the exact same thing as the officer. At the end of the day, my life>his, it's just that simple.

I watched the video over and over again. Watch 1:09-1:10, to me at no point is he "reaching for a gun." His hands stayed still, he turned slowly to see the officer who was yelling at him. When you turn, your jacket is going to turn too. If you watch the video you can see he never reached into his pocket at all. His hands stayed on his lap, never reaching or even any bending motion.

I'm not trying to be the "OMG cop shot defenseless man!!! Eff the police!! Sue his ass!!" person. Just saying what I saw. I did not see the man who got shot do anything that I would consider hostile.

[GTSLOW]

Just watching the video IMO I'd have to say the cop was 100% wrong. The whole situation didn't seem like much. They took off fast, drove what 3-4 blocks his buddy was a knuckle head and hit the curb. But he stopped, the cop gave him what one command? The guy literally looks back and gets shot. I did not see any kind of violent jester or anything even remote to one.

My vote is fry the cop.

[Mr Twigbert]

Based on the video, I'm don't think it was a 'good' shoot but to face 11 years is insane. The news article states the cop turned on the camera cuz he had a feeling something was going to happen. You don't try to record your illegal actions if you plan on getting away with it.

His career is over, the dept will have to pay but I don't think the cop should get prison time for making a questionable split second decision.

[Plum Crazy]

I guess they shouldnt have run from police.

[lotsals1]

bullshit , cop reacted 100% incorrectly. The 2 didnt know it was a squad behind them when they raced.He pulled over. Now I,ve been pulled over this exact way.the cop laughed and said "How could you guys not of seen me".
These 2 didnt run from the cop in my opinion. The guy can never walk again over a drag race. The guy was wide open the cop was behind his car,then starts screaming at him paralyzed ,the second that bullet hit him he was paralyzed. There was 2 squads there the situation was controlled .the only thing the guy did was turn and look at the cop with a look like "wtf put my hands up for drag racing".

[CATNHAT]

just watching the video imo i'd have to say the cop was 100% wrong. The whole situation didn't seem like much. They took off fast, drove what 3-4 blocks his buddy was a knuckle head and hit the curb. But he stopped, the cop gave him what one command? The guy literally looks back and gets shot. I did not see any kind of violent jester or anything even remote to one.

x2

[lit666]

bullshit , cop reacted 100% incorrectly. The 2 didnt know it was a squad behind them when they raced.He pulled over. Now I,ve been pulled over this exact way.the cop laughed and said "How could you guys not of seen me".
These 2 didnt run from the cop in my opinion. The guy can never walk again over a drag race. The guy was wide open the cop was behind his car,then starts screaming at him paralyzed ,the second that bullet hit him he was paralyzed. There was 2 squads there the situation was controlled .the only thing the guy did was turn and look at the cop with a look like "wtf put my hands up for drag racing".

I guess you know the whole story. Tells us all the events that led up to the chase please. Tell us all the calls that came into the dispatcher please to make sure there wasn't one for any "trouble with subjects" or "Robbery" calls that had just taken place. Since the cop acted 100% incorrctly and all. Lets not forget how his buddy lost control of his bike and jumped the curve. Would have sucked if a kid was struck or maybe even your kid. Yeah he can't walk now because of a drag race... Tell the 6 year old that died 2 weeks ago at 91st and Bradley that it was only a drag race.

I'm not saying the officer was right but dont' say he was 100% in the wrong when you have no idea of the circumstances.

[Rocket Power]

I guess you know the whole story. Tells us all the events that led up to the chase please. Tell us all the calls that came into the dispatcher please to make sure there wasn't one for any "trouble with subjects" or "Robbery" calls that had just taken place. Since the cop acted 100% incorrctly and all. Lets not forget how his buddy lost control of his bike and jumped the curve. Would have sucked if a kid was struck or maybe even your kid. Yeah he can't walk now because of a drag race... Tell the 6 year old that died 2 weeks ago at 91st and Bradley that it was only a drag race.

I'm not saying the officer was right but dont' say he was 100% in the wrong when you have no idea of the circumstances.

x2

[Waver]

Based on the video, I'm don't think it was a 'good' shoot but to face 11 years is insane. The news article states the cop turned on the camera cuz he had a feeling something was going to happen. You don't try to record your illegal actions if you plan on getting away with it.

His career is over, the dept will have to pay but I don't think the cop should get prison time for making a questionable split second decision.

I agree with this. He should be sued, the department will have to pay ect. However in the end it was just very poor judgment on the officers part.


I guess you know the whole story. Tells us all the events that led up to the chase please. Tell us all the calls that came into the dispatcher please to make sure there wasn't one for any "trouble with subjects" or "Robbery" calls that had just taken place. Since the cop acted 100% incorrctly and all. Lets not forget how his buddy lost control of his bike and jumped the curve. Would have sucked if a kid was struck or maybe even your kid. Yeah he can't walk now because of a drag race... Tell the 6 year old that died 2 weeks ago at 91st and Bradley that it was only a drag race.

I'm not saying the officer was right but dont' say he was 100% in the wrong when you have no idea of the circumstances.
QFT +1

[Prince Valiant]

I'd say the cop wasn't 100% wrong at all; simply because it was the dumb-ass biker knobs themselves that put themselves in that situation.

To contend that it was simply a drag race is wrong too...how is the cop supposed to know what's going through their minds? Drag race or decided to run for unknown and perhaps nefarious reasons? You can say that they stopped, sure...but to the police officer it may simply have been that they were cornered by the other cop car. Likewise, it may have appeared to the shooting officer that the other biker was still trying to get away...and though we have the luxury of sitting at a computer able to see what's going on across the intersection, I'm sure the shooting officer was more than a little focused on the stopped individual.

Now beyond this, as Twigbert points out, we have a different perspective than the shooting officer. While we can fairly say it does not appear he's going for a gun, our perspective is quite different than the officer, who is unable to see the biker's right hand, and can only assume it's location based on how he holds his arm.

Where is the biker's right hand? On his upper thigh right around his right pocket/right waistband/belt area. From this position, how is officer to tell whether or not it's *on* his pocket and not *in* his pocket (or toward his waist area) reaching for a gun? Again, cops are humans with a duty to ensure their own protection as well. Though it might seem unfair to blame the victim, the victim really should have had both hands on the handle bars...just as when we're pulled over, both hands should be visible on wheels.

I see this as a tragedy, no doubt. It's unfortunate that this occurred, but at the same time I see it as understandable given the circumstances. They are trying for a felony assault conviction, which imo, he should be found innocent not because he did nothing wrong; but because his intent was NOT to simply cause grevious bodily injury, but to protect self. It may prove wise that the officer is removed from his current duties, if not from police work altogether, since he showed that his judgment might not be cut out for working out in the field and could perhaps be a further danger to civilians...so perhaps reassignment to desk/other police work if not discharged from service.

The police force should be monetarily responsible for some of the victims medical/ continued care cost...but only a portion of those cost not totaling over 50% of the expected lifetime cost of his condition.