Ford MAKES 1 billion in the third quarter

[BOSS LX]

This is a good sign!
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601082&sid=axUjQh8ehVKM

[Prince Valiant]

This is a good sign!
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601082&sid=axUjQh8ehVKMNot to be a negative guy, but how much of that was federally induced?

One can say, "But chris, they didn't take any fed money! It's all them!"

to which I say BS...Ford was help by Cash$4clunkers more than anyone...that was a lot of federal dollars that subsidized purchases. Some purchases were delayed with impending c4c, and some were expedited for c4c...so it's impact on the 3rd 1/4 were relatively dramatic as a result.

What will be important is not a performance in a quarter, but a long term trend. To say that to be a healthy company, they need to not just post many quarters of gain, but quarters in which it' multiple, if not 10's of billions.

[animal]

Since all manufacturers could've taken advantage of c4c, did any other manufacturers post profits that large this quarter? Not being sarcastic, i'd like to know.

[BOSS LX]

Not to be a negative guy, but how much of that was federally induced?

One can say, "But chris, they didn't take any fed money! It's all them!"

to which I say BS...Ford was help by Cash$4clunkers more than anyone...that was a lot of federal dollars that subsidized purchases. Some purchases were delayed with impending c4c, and some were expedited for c4c...so it's impact on the 3rd 1/4 were relatively dramatic as a result.

What will be important is not a performance in a quarter, but a long term trend. To say that to be a healthy company, they need to not just post many quarters of gain, but quarters in which it' multiple, if not 10's of billions.

Ford is projected to have big gains in 2011. Who else can say that?

[BAD LS1]

Yeah the 4th quarter will probably be back to normal im sure. We get that shit all the time at my work, we get hurricanes, sell a bunch of generators and we can say we had a several million dollar profit in 1 quarter... This is a "flash in the pan" if you will IMHO, they will go back to being a mediocure car producer soon enough.

[07ROUSHSTG3]

ford wins. game over.

[BAD LS1]

Ford is projected to have big gains in 2011. Who else can say that?

Thats a year + away though, mopar will be out of the game soon enough which will only help GM and Ford together.

[BOSS LX]

ford wins. game over.

That sure is the case, more times then not! :thumbsup

[BOSS LX]

Thats a year + away though, mopar will be out of the game soon enough which will only help GM and Ford together.

I agree Mopar will be done. I would not be surprised if Ford and GM team up down the road in some ways.

[johnny--2k]

Compare the numbers to everyone else with C4C then, ford still came out on top, because they are starting to do things right for a change....

Their product line is SOLID and new, and they dont need buyback guarantees to get people in the door... :rolleyes:

[DR.FORD]

It's funny and entertaining when GM guys are butthurt:rolf
Ford=surviving
GM=dropping lines and failing
Chrysler=epic fail
BTW Ford was not the only company in the c4c deal (duh), so all had the same opportunity to sell vehicles-and make money.

[Crawlin]

We can all admit that GM needed to drop lines anyways, hahah

that shit should have been done like 10 years ago with Oldsmobile

[JaMichaels]

GM dropped lines, but didn't Ford? Don't see much new coming from Lincoln and Mercury commercial wise.. I have no information, so looking to be informed.

GM still the better manufacturer, Ford benefited from C4C the most because well.. Almost every car turned in happened to be a FORD. Look at the top 10 most turned in cars, and if you do a top ten list by actual vehicle years and models, 4-5 of the spots are all different year Explorers.

Which meant they were more then likely took their Ford loyalty to a Ford dealer to buy another Ford product, making the Focus the most popular domestic vehicle purchased.

Just wait for all the C4C owners default on their loans and all of Fords financers go under because they gave people that could barely afford to take care of their pile of shit clunker, a brand new car payment and having to insure it at a higher rate for loan reasons.

Nostradamus is right, 2012, the only thing he forgot to mention was because of Cash4Clunkers.

[johnny--2k]

Ford didnt drop any lines, they still have Ford, Lincoln, and Mercury, as well as Mazda and Volvo. They just sold off Land Rover and Jaguar because they were dragging them down...

As for Fords Financers, they prob wont get affected much. Being in Finance for a dealership I can tell you that about 60% of our deals here during C4C (can't speak for any other dealerships, but I'm sure it was similar) were cash buyers, so that theory goes right out the window. And what makes you say these people couldnt take care of their clunkers? Did you see any of the cars that came in? It's actually a shame they were destroyed, most of them were in decent condition.

Cash 4 Clunkers is a deceiving name, because it had to do with gas mileage not junk status.

Also, relating to credit, with the economy the way it is, the banks are not giving out loans to everyone and anyone like they used to, they learned their lesson the hard way and finance approvals have gone down significantly for people who's credit is shaky at best...unless you are a rockstar, getting financed without a problem or significant money down is becoming harder and harder to do, I see it every day. I just had a guy today that was well into the mid 700's for score, never missed a payment in his life, and the bank still asked for $1300 down. Debt to income was good, history was good, just wanted some commitment from the customer and we were only a few hundred over book so that wasn't the reasoning either.

[Exitspeed]

Ford is projected to have big gains in 2011. Who else can say that?

Subaru and Mini to name a couple.

[BAD LS1]

Subaru and Mini to name a couple.

And probably hyundai too...

[johnny--2k]

but none of the big 3 other than Ford can....

[Waver]

GM still the better manufacturer, Ford benefited from C4C the most because well.. Almost every car turned in happened to be a FORD. Look at the top 10 most turned in cars, and if you do a top ten list by actual vehicle years and models, 4-5 of the spots are all different year Explorers.

Which meant they were more then likely took their Ford loyalty to a Ford dealer to buy another Ford product, making the Focus the most popular domestic vehicle purchased.
I hate to say it, but there isnt much loyalty with consumers these days, unless you are talking about the purchase of a mustang or a camaro. Just because Fords were the most traded in vehicle really dosnt mean anything except that more people were able to pay off their ford, and or more of those vehicles were bought in those years. We took in a few chevys, and a few of those people who traided in their chevy bought a Ford because they said that they had the better product, or were pissed because gm and not ford, took the bail out money.


Ford didnt drop any lines, they still have Ford, Lincoln, and Mercury, as well as Mazda and Volvo. They just sold off Land Rover and Jaguar because they were dragging them down...

As for Fords Financers, they prob wont get affected much. Being in Finance for a dealership I can tell you that about 60% of our deals here during C4C (can't speak for any other dealerships, but I'm sure it was similar) were cash buyers, so that theory goes right out the window. And what makes you say these people couldnt take care of their clunkers? Did you see any of the cars that came in? It's actually a shame they were destroyed, most of them were in decent condition.

Cash 4 Clunkers is a deceiving name, because it had to do with gas mileage not junk status.

Also, relating to credit, with the economy the way it is, the banks are not giving out loans to everyone and anyone like they used to, they learned their lesson the hard way and finance approvals have gone down significantly for people who's credit is shaky at best...unless you are a rockstar, getting financed without a problem or significant money down is becoming harder and harder to do, I see it every day. I just had a guy today that was well into the mid 700's for score, never missed a payment in his life, and the bank still asked for $1300 down. Debt to income was good, history was good, just wanted some commitment from the customer and we were only a few hundred over book so that wasn't the reasoning either.
Same here, a lot of the c4c people were cash deals (all of mine were) and from what I have heard, a lot of the other sales peoples were as well. The whole finance thing that you talked about we actually addressed in one of our sales meetings a while ago. Unless you have almost or perfect credit, you almost cant buy a car with no money down, or for that matter with out 20% down. Now I am sure that a few people on here have bought cars with out that money down, however every situation is different.

Subaru and Mini to name a couple.
Anyone can say that they have huge growth when they have low sales numbers to begin with

And probably hyundai too...

They are the Number 1 fastest growing car manufacturer in the country right now....a lot of that has to do with having a better product than they did 5 years ago, a impecible warranty, and low pricing....In some cases, ford and gm cant beat that.

[4eyedstang]

i think alot of people voted with there money against the GM bailout.
but it wont be long before the unions finally succeed in destroying the US auto industry.

DETROIT (AP) -- Ford Motor Co. workers have overwhelmingly rejected contract changes that would have allowed the automaker to cut labor costs, leaving Ford at a disadvantage to its Detroit rivals as it continues its struggle to return to profitability.

The United Auto Workers union had given local unions until Monday to complete voting. But a person briefed on the voting said Saturday that the contract changes have been rejected by large margins. The person asked not to be named because the UAW hasn't announced the results yet.

The UAW and Ford agreed to the contract changes several weeks ago, but Ford workers needed to ratify them. Ford has 41,000 UAW-represented workers.

Two large union locals in Kentucky and Ford's home city of Dearborn rejected the contract Friday, sealing its fate. Those unions together represent 13,000 Ford workers. Exact tallies weren't available, but at least 12 UAW locals representing about 27,500 workers so far have vetoed the deal, many overwhelmingly. Only about four locals with a total of 7,000 members favored the pact.

Ford sought the deal to bring its labor costs in line with Detroit rivals Chrysler Group LLC and General Motors Co., both of which won concessions from the union as they headed into bankruptcy protection earlier this year. Under pattern bargaining, the three automakers usually match pay, benefits and other contract provisions.

But workers weren't convinced they should make more concessions, since Ford avoided bankruptcy and is considered healthier than its rivals. At least two Wall Street analysts are predicting that Ford could report a profit Monday when it announces third-quarter earnings.

Rocky Comito, president of UAW Local 862 in Louisville, said Friday that workers felt they were being asked to sacrifice more than the company's executives. Ford CEO Alan Mulally made $17.7 million last year, although that was down 22 percent from the year before.

"Some want to see management give more at the upper level," Comito said.

Ford was offering workers a $1,000 bonus if they ratified the contract. But the contract also would have frozen entry-level pay, changed some work rules and limited workers' ability to strike.

A message seeking comment was left Saturday for the UAW. UAW President Ron Gettelfinger said Friday that there wouldn't be a revote if the contract changes failed.

"If it fails, there would be no reason to go back to the bargaining table," Gettelfinger said at a community event in Detroit. "We have a democratic process in place. People have a right to express themselves. We recognize there's a lot of misinformation about it out there, but that is what it is."

Factory-level union leaders have known for several days that the deal would be defeated, said one Detroit-area official who asked not to be identified because the voting is not completed.

The union did a poor job of explaining the need to preserve jobs and keep Ford competitive with GM and Chrysler, the official said.

He doesn't believe members will approve any more changes until the 2011 contract, which will leave Ford at a disadvantage and has the potential to knock the company from its position as the strongest financially of the Detroit Three.

"Our goal should be to keep Ford Motor Co. going in the right direction," he said.

Gary Chaison, a professor of labor relations at Clark University in Worcester, Mass., said the vote was a slap to UAW leadership. It's extremely rare for union members to oppose the union's recommended vote.

Chaison said the vote damages the reputation of UAW Vice President Bob King, the chief Ford negotiator, who has been mentioned as a successor to Gettelfinger when the union elects a new president in 2010.

"The sign of a good leader is that you can agree to something and then sell it to the membership," Chaison said.

Chaison said Ford asked for too much too soon after workers already agreed to concessions earlier this year. He also said Ford lacked credibility because its financial situation wasn't as dire as GM's or Chrysler's.

"They made such a strong case about not going to bankruptcy court and turning the corner, so they couldn't go to the workers and say, 'We need this to turn the corner,'" he said.

The no votes came even as Ford reached a similar cost-cutting agreement with the Canadian Auto Workers union Friday. The CAW has agreed to cuts in benefits in exchange for product guarantees, but that agreement must be ratified by Canadian workers.

In addition to the plants in Louisville and Dearborn, workers at factories in Chicago; Claycomo, Mo.; and Livonia, Plymouth, Sterling Heights, Flat Rock, Ypsilanti Township, Mich., rejected the deal. Locals in Wayne, Mich.; Cleveland; Indianapolis and St. Paul, Minn., voted in favor.
____________________________________

[07ROUSHSTG3]

the UAW will ruin what ford has going unless ford has some balls. the people in canada, southern US, and mexico would be happy to build a FORD.

[70 cutlass 442]

GM dropped lines, but didn't Ford? Don't see much new coming from Lincoln and Mercury commercial wise.. I have no information, so looking to be informed.



This is kind of an ignorant statement....
Ford maybe didnt introduce any real new names or lines, but thats a hell of a lot better then going backwards and cutting lines like GM has been doing like crazy....





GM still the better manufacturer, Ford benefited from C4C the most because well.. Almost every car turned in happened to be a FORD. Look at the top 10 most turned in cars, and if you do a top ten list by actual vehicle years and models, 4-5 of the spots are all different year Explorers. Which meant they were more then likely took their Ford loyalty to a Ford dealer to buy another Ford product, making the Focus the most popular domestic vehicle purchased.


So, you are saying that Ford knows how to create a loyal customer base but GM cant..... :durr




Just wait for all the C4C owners default on their loans and all of Fords financers go under because they gave people that could barely afford to take care of their pile of shit clunker, a brand new car payment and having to insure it at a higher rate for loan reasons.

So Ford customers are the only ones that will default on loans?

[OxmanWI]

I agree Mopar will be done. I would not be surprised if Ford and GM team up down the road in some ways.

Wouldn't they have to go through the government since there owned my Uncle Sam? Besides GM would drag them down, I think that would be a horrible idea.

[Ricky Bobby]

woopdee doo that is all now back to ur regularly scheduled Flipped Over Rolling Dumpster show :goof

[BOSS LX]

Wouldn't they have to go through the government since there owned my Uncle Sam? Besides GM would drag them down, I think that would be a horrible idea.

Gm will not be owned by Obama forever. I am not saying they will be one in the same, but I do think some cross over will be needed.

[michelle]

I <3 Ford. Good to see they are getting stronger again!

It's all because of the Taurus. :goof

[FoxStang]

I <3 Ford. Good to see they are getting stronger again!

It's all because of the Taurus. :goof

Seriously though, I see the new Tauruses everywhere now, quite many of them SHO's too.

And Ford is doing relatively well because they started restructuring 3 years ago when they brought in Allan Mulally, and not slicing lines within the last year like GM. Ford's recent turnaround doesn't have that much to do with what they did over the past year, but what they started doing 3 years ago when they realized an internal management crisis, upon other problems. They're still plagued with the UAW crap, but at least they're not rearranging furniture on the Titanic, which could hardly be said for Chrysler, and even GM with its government restructuring program.

[wrath]

As soon as Ford's loans come due they'll be screwed.

And I still don't see them saying they made more money last quarter than they spent. Article says they still have negative cashflow.

[Waver]

As soon as Ford's loans come due they'll be screwed.

And I still don't see them saying they made more money last quarter than they spent. Article says they still have negative cashflow.

Well who dosnt have negative cashflow from the big three, or for that matter, The top 5 auto manufacturers in the world? Even toyota has negative cash flow. As long as Fords stock goes up, I think they will be fine when their loans come due....There is a reason why Ford has been around for the last 100+ years and others havent (or havent been bought to form a bigger corporation)

[07ROUSHSTG3]

ford credit is even making money, they are fine.

they will end up offering more shares soon to get more cash. the first time they did it, the shareholders didn't mind it hardly affected the value.

[kornholio788]

GM dropped lines, but didn't Ford? Don't see much new coming from Lincoln and Mercury commercial wise.. I have no information, so looking to be informed.



Being a salesman at a Lincoln Mercury store I can tell you that Lincoln has the brand new MKS and MKT out. Both very baller cars. The MKZ was redesigned. Mercury's new design on the Milan is nice. And a lot of car for the money. As is the mariner. The MKT is probably their biggest new thing. But each car recently had a revamp and are very solid cars.

As for customer loyalty. I would def disagree with you. I am going to say that at least 75% of our customer base is previous customers. Yes Lincolns and Mercs are more of the elder type car. But even not accounting for that having working there for as short as I have, I have heard alot of people saying they have always owned a Ford product and will continue to buy ford, lincoln, or mercs.

[Rocket Power]

It's all because of the Taurus. :goof
We had a new AWD Taurus at work (before we shortened it):goof and I really liked it. I could see them selling well.

[Got Boost]

Ford is projected to have big gains in 2011. Who else can say that?Hyundai...I believe they did the best in the c4c deal also ... Ford did the best of the Big 2 US car companies Toyota is 3 ....Just sayin

[DR.FORD]

woopdee doo that is all now back to ur regularly scheduled Flipped Over Rolling Dumpster show :goof

:rolf good one!

[Got Boost]

woopdee doo that is all now back to ur regularly scheduled Flipped Over Rolling Dumpster show :goofall we need is a drum rim shot:headbang

[Crawlin]

This is kind of an ignorant statement....
Ford maybe didnt introduce any real new names or lines, but thats a hell of a lot better then going backwards and cutting lines like GM has been doing like crazy....


So, you are saying that Ford knows how to create a loyal customer base but GM cant..... :durr


So Ford customers are the only ones that will default on loans?


I don't know if I should be directly quoting you, but I believe there were incentives during the C4C sale that required some to finance through FMCC or GMAC, etc... GMAC won't finance anyone under 700 credit score while I could get someone with a 0 credit score a car through Ford. Then again I don't know how it is over the past year. So yes, the chances of a FMCC default compared to that of a GMAC loan, would be higher. However, the deals going through outside banks, who knows.

As for everyone quoting the turn in vehicles and what was the most turned in vehicles, you have to remember that you won't see(for the most part) any import cars on the list because they have been getting 18mpg or better for the last 20-30 years. It was a smart move by the administration in that by limiting the mpg cutoff to that 18mpg, you are effectively cutting out the imports being turned in and since most people in the US are severely brand loyal(just look at this thread alone), a majority of the cars being sold would be domestic. They just didn't account for(as usual) how pissed off we are as the American people that our money keeps getting wasted away on companies with failed business plans. So that's why you'll see top vehicles PURCHASED being an import.

[BAD LS1]

I don't know if I should be directly quoting you, but I believe there were incentives during the C4C sale that required some to finance through FMCC or GMAC, etc... GMAC won't finance anyone under 700 credit score while I could get someone with a 0 credit score a car through Ford. Then again I don't know how it is over the past year. So yes, the chances of a FMCC default compared to that of a GMAC loan, would be higher. However, the deals going through outside banks, who knows.

As for everyone quoting the turn in vehicles and what was the most turned in vehicles, you have to remember that you won't see(for the most part) any import cars on the list because they have been getting 18mpg or better for the last 20-30 years. It was a smart move by the administration in that by limiting the mpg cutoff to that 18mpg, you are effectively cutting out the imports being turned in and since most people in the US are severely brand loyal(just look at this thread alone), a majority of the cars being sold would be domestic. They just didn't account for(as usual) how pissed off we are as the American people that our money keeps getting wasted away on companies with failed business plans. So that's why you'll see top vehicles PURCHASED being an import.

You are correct on the 700+ for GMAC, They even said that at the dealer when i got the Camaro that they would send my app through even with both of us over 700, but they have been very picky which i did end up with GMAC on that one.

[70 cutlass 442]

I thought GMAC had loosened up their policy when it came to the 700 score in an attempt to move some more vehicles... but thats good to know that they didnt!

[Crawlin]

Yeah, it's fucked up. I remember asking the dealer rep... "so wait, someone with 4 cars previously that cmoes in at a 699 cause they have a slightly high revolving credit line(credit card's balance) that paid perfectly won't get a car, but the girl straight outta college that paid her tuition and victoria secret bill will get a car? I know who i'm still giving my money to :)

[CATNHAT]

I predict Ford, Toyota, VW last ones standing. The shit is going to hit the proverbial fan once inflation kicks in. Interest rates will rise and no one will be buying anything.

Reality is:

C4C was a good for foreign car mfgs, cost to us taxpayers=$24,000/car sold
Stimulus package is a bust for "creating" new jobs=???? right now white house saying "saved jobs" stimulus was supposed to "CREATE" jobe, HUGE difference!
Obamacare will be the worst endeavour this country will ever pursue. Even Hillary was smart enough to give it up.

Obama is a farce and is single handidly destroying our economy, country, political structure, etc, etc, etc.............

Hang on to your wallets.

[07ROUSHSTG3]

but the girl straight outta college that paid her tuition and victoria secret bill will get a car?

was she hot?

[Ricky Bobby]

:rolf good one!

sorry jim had a bad day lol ur ford rocks though :thumbsup