View Full Version : What a Scam
2006 Scion XB 5dr Wagon Stock#: TP7450 Miles: 64446
Sticker Price: $16,999
Note the sticker price, with 64,000 miles its stickered at a dollar shy of 17000. A Brand new Scion XB with an Automatic Trans is priced at 17370, a manual at 16,470.
I know other dealers do this too, but anyone with common sense is gonna have a light bulb come on upstairs.
Crawlin
10-15-2008, 03:04 PM
that's a heiser toyota stock number, hahahaha
it's either only got 6000 miles w/ one too many 4's in it seeing as it's a human that uploads them, or they haven't changed the prices after the push pull or drag sale :)
wrath
10-15-2008, 03:05 PM
I know other dealers do this too, but anyone with common sense is gonna have a light bulb come on upstairs.
I was at my favorite dealership today (Mike Juneau's rip off artists) and they had a Pontiac G8 on the showroom floor. 4,000+ miles, used. They wanted sticker for it.
So let me get this straight, if I were to want to trade in a G8 with 4,000 miles they might give me $22-24k for it. But because it was their doucheberries that beat it the first 4k it is magically worth sticker? Everybody knows you lose the first year's residual value as soon as you take it home.
They also had an Acadia with mad tight pimpin dubs on it. The 20" wheels magically added $3,600 to sticker. You can buy 09 Acadias with rub-a-dub-dubs straight from the factory now. I don't know if they made it to the dealerships yet but my Dad was telling me about it (he does QC on Acadias/Enclaves/Outlooks) and it's not that expensive of an option.
that's a heiser toyota stock number, hahahaha
it's either only got 6000 miles w/ one too many 4's in it seeing as it's a human that uploads them, or they haven't changed the prices after the push pull or drag sale :)
Yup, looking at HHR's I was laughing my balls off too. Especially with the GM sale they just had for employee pricing, you could get a new one for a grand or two less then a used one :rolf
Exitspeed
10-15-2008, 03:35 PM
Those cars are pretty popular used too.
Get the HHR. Better car anyway.
HHR won't work for me, nobody makes a roof mounted utility rack for it. I need to transport both bikes and kayaks.
PonyKiller87
10-15-2008, 03:56 PM
HHR won't work for me, nobody makes a roof mounted utility rack for it. I need to transport both bikes and kayaks.
All the air bag / dropped suspension stuff you've built and you can't make a roof rack? lol Theres probably one out there that would fit with a little modification, just isnt listed for it.
I'm not confident buying a 13000 dollar vehicle and modifying the roof to build a roof rack, I do suspension not body work :)
I took both style Yakima mounts to the dealer when I went to test drive the HHR, and neither would work due to the extreme curvature of the roof from the tops of the doors and the factory roof rack equipped HHR's oddly enough have non-usable roof rack bars for the yakima and thule systems.
Exitspeed
10-15-2008, 04:13 PM
HHR won't work for me, nobody makes a roof mounted utility rack for it. I need to transport both bikes and kayaks.
These things won't work?
http://chevrolet.dealerfit.com/store/chevrolet-hhr-roof-rack-utility-bars-prod691_17247.php
http://chevroletpartspeople.com/searchproduct.asp?model=HHR&catid=3371888326297844&year=07&productdesc=Roof+Rack+Utility+Bars
Not for what I need to do, no.
Exitspeed
10-15-2008, 04:35 PM
Not for what I need to do, no.
Whack.
Have you thought about a MP5?
http://www.auto123.com/ArtImages/59594/2002-Mazda-Protege5-03.jpg
You can get one sooooo cheap. Good looking. Practical. Dependable.
Crawlin
10-15-2008, 04:44 PM
probably get a WRX wagon now in the mid teens
Exitspeed
10-15-2008, 04:53 PM
probably get a WRX wagon now in the mid teens
Good call.
Or even better: 2005 Saab 9-2X Linear. You can get one for around $14000.
lordairgtar
10-15-2008, 05:40 PM
HHR won't work for me, nobody makes a roof mounted utility rack for it. I need to transport both bikes and kayaks.
Pork, look at this thread on the HHR forums
http://chevyhhr.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8910&highlight=cross+bars
BoosTT
10-15-2008, 05:47 PM
I've actually been watching scion prices go up. For a while you could get a used xb with 80k for $7k. This was about 18 months ago. No way anymore. I think gas prices have a lot to do with it. Isn't that a 1.5L? I heard something like 27mpg city.
Rocket Power
10-15-2008, 06:32 PM
Whack.
Have you thought about a MP5?
http://www.auto123.com/ArtImages/59594/2002-Mazda-Protege5-03.jpg
You can get one sooooo cheap. Good looking. Practical. Dependable.
This MP5 is better looking,practical , and dependable:rolf
http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/smith/hk/hk01.jpg
probably get a WRX wagon now in the mid teens
Get an Audi A6 wagon with the V8 for the same price and better fuel economy.
formul8
10-15-2008, 07:53 PM
Get an Audi A6 wagon with the V8 for the same price and better fuel economy.
And huge, eye watering repair bills!!!
CATNHAT
10-15-2008, 07:57 PM
Buy American and you wont have the SCION logo on your ass.
And you wonder why GM is closing the Janesville plant?
Buy American and you wont have the SCION logo on your ass.
And you wonder why GM is closing the Janesville plant?
Everything in my driveway is American, for now. GM can't compete, the XB is the same vehicle as the HHR but its 5 grand cheaper gets better fuel mileage, its more dependable, and I can put a utility rack on the roof!
Windsors 03 Cobra
10-15-2008, 08:47 PM
What about a Toy Matrix ?
Pork, look at this thread on the HHR forums
http://chevyhhr.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8910&highlight=cross+bars
Thanks for the link, it looks like Thule makes some mounts for the HHR factory roof rack. Looking for Yakima stuff, I will search around on the site and see what I can find.
wrath
10-15-2008, 09:00 PM
Everything in my driveway is American, for now. GM can't compete, the XB is the same vehicle as the HHR but its 5 grand cheaper gets better fuel mileage, its more dependable, and I can put a utility rack on the roof!
Have you driven an xB? It makes an Element seem like a Jaguar and the HHR feel like an Escalade. I can't see how someone who likes to drive ever being in a first-gen xB.
Toyota could've saved some money by putting a Tecumseh under the hood.
Honestly, if you're looking at an xB, consider a Vibe or Matrix first. Just as underpowered (don't try to get on the expressway with a headwind or an uphill ramp) but a lot more creature comforts and more aesthetically pleasing.
After reading up on the HHR forums it looks like the factory roof rack isn't made to support the drag multiple bikes would create, let alone a pair of kayaks. Looks like the HHR is no longer an option.
Have you driven an xB? It makes an Element seem like a Jaguar and the HHR feel like an Escalade. I can't see how someone who likes to drive ever being in a first-gen xB.
Toyota could've saved some money by putting a Tecumseh under the hood.
Honestly, if you're looking at an xB, consider a Vibe or Matrix first. Just as underpowered (don't try to get on the expressway with a headwind or an uphill ramp) but a lot more creature comforts and more aesthetically pleasing.
I never drove a first gen, I drove the new one and thats what I'm looking at buying. It had plenty of power, I'm not looking for a race car here. The new XB rides WAY nicer then the Element and the HHR, I wanted to stick with an HHR because its GM.
lordairgtar
10-15-2008, 11:50 PM
Well, you researched it. Too bad the HHR isn't suited to your needs. As a household with both HHR and Scion xB, I can tell you the HHR is quicker and has a better power band. I have the 2.2 engine and I think the Scion is smaller. One complaint with my HHR is it's made in Mexico. I would have rather had it made here, but it was what I was looking for, something retro and could haul my art stuff and my DJ equipment. No one had quite what I wanted in looks and practicality. Good luck with whatever you get.
Well, you researched it. Too bad the HHR isn't suited to your needs. As a household with both HHR and Scion xB, I can tell you the HHR is quicker and has a better power band. I have the 2.2 engine and I think the Scion is smaller. One complaint with my HHR is it's made in Mexico. I would have rather had it made here, but it was what I was looking for, something retro and could haul my art stuff and my DJ equipment. No one had quite what I wanted in looks and practicality. Good luck with whatever you get.
You have both? What year xB? The new ones are much improved over the first gens, the cabin is MUCH quieter and a bit larger then the first gens to from all the reviews I have been reading.
Exitspeed
10-16-2008, 08:40 AM
And you wonder why GM is closing the Janesville plant?
Oh, I could go off on a tangent about that for days. But I'll refrain.
Pork, any other options?
I'm looking for a midsize wagon / van that gets 30+ mpg hwy that can haul up to 4 bikes and 2 kayaks. I use my truck to haul the kayaks now, but will be getting rid of it by the end of the month. I'm also looking for something that isn't going to cost a fortune to fix when it does need repair, so most imports are out of the question.
Exitspeed
10-16-2008, 09:44 AM
Are you dead set on buying American? It leaves you with very few options.
2005 Legacy Wagon!
Or and Outback.
Done and done.
I would love a Legacy wagon as a DD and something to haul bikes and shit in.
Cost of repair on a Subaru is too high, plus I am not a fan of AWD. Toyota isn't terribly priced, nor is Honda. Honda is gay though :)
Slow Joe
10-16-2008, 09:54 AM
The 9-2X is a WRX Wagon in discuise (I'm assuming you already knew that...)
Otherwise if you're looking at Saabs there is the 9-3 SportCombi or the 9-5 SportCombi or Wagon depending on year.
HHRs are ok cars, the one I've got just makes alot of "normal" front end noise... And is uncomfortable on long rides (It's an LT w/o Leather) But you've already ruled that one out, so nevermind...
Slow Joe
10-16-2008, 09:58 AM
Yes, Saab 9-2X... Sorry, I thought you had mentioned it earlier in the thread... :durr
Edit: Nevermind, that was that exitspeed guy... I was just browsing fast and thought it was one of your posts :rolf
And huge, eye watering repair bills!!!
That's the good engine. One should stay away from anything that Audi makes with a turbo. I think that engine also has a timing chain.
Anyway, Pork should be able to fix an Audi.
Also, from my experiences, Audi parts tend to cost less than Ford or Honda parts. It's the labor cost that will rape you while you sleep.
Exitspeed
10-16-2008, 10:24 AM
What is a 9-2x? Saab?
It's a WRX wagon.
Best looking WRX we ever got. lol
http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/autoreview/400x266/2005-Saab-9-2X-05903081990002.jpg
http://www.saabhistory.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/01/saab92x.jpg
Exitspeed
10-16-2008, 10:25 AM
^
WRX wagon with Saab sheet metal from the A-pillar forward.
Slow Joe
10-16-2008, 10:46 AM
^
WRX wagon with Saab sheet metal from the A-pillar forward.
And Saab seats/interior touches (if I remember correctly)
GinoRin
10-16-2008, 10:58 AM
yep, the Saab 9-2x Aero is a great ride. It has to be an Aero though, the linear is non-turbo if I remember correctly. I had one for about 6 weeks and loved it. The interior is so much nicer than the WRX theres not much to compare. And because of the WRX popularity, not many people know about these Saabs, so theyre priced about the same. The thing was a BEAST in the snow, and I beat the shit out of it. :rolf I'd def. take a close look at them.
Exitspeed
10-16-2008, 11:03 AM
Yea, looks like you can get one for around $14000 used. I just checked Autotrader.
It's a pretty BA daily driver. Especially for what you are going to be doing with it.
Slow Joe
10-16-2008, 11:18 AM
A Subaru for folks who don’t want one, the all-wheel-drive (AWD) Saab 9-2x Linear is virtually identical to the Subaru Impreza 2.5RS hatchback
Slow Joe
10-16-2008, 11:22 AM
Yea, looks like you can get one for around $14000 used. I just checked Autotrader.
It's a pretty BA daily driver. Especially for what you are going to be doing with it.
Luxury Motors Downers Grove has a 46k mile Linear for $11995
Prestige Imports has a 54k mi Linear for $9995
The Linear at EVS has been there since April '06, I know because I took the pictures of it. That being said the one at Sommers seems a little high.
And if you're looking for an Aero it seems that Zimbrick has a decent deal on theirs with 52k for $15465.
Waver
10-16-2008, 11:55 AM
Luxury Motors Downers Grove has a 46k mile Linear for $11995
Prestige Imports has a 54k mi Linear for $9995
The Linear at EVS has been there since April '06, I know because I took the pictures of it. That being said the one at Sommers seems a little high.
And if you're looking for an Aero it seems that Zimbrick has a decent deal on theirs with 52k for $15465.
yeah, but good luck trying to get a deal on the one that is at evs.....ernie dosnt give a shit if the car has been there 20 days or 20 years....he wont budge, just say LOW MILEs on it lol
Windsors 03 Cobra
10-16-2008, 12:10 PM
The Ford Flex looks like a roomy as heck fuel pincher, give them a look.
jbiscuit
10-16-2008, 12:26 PM
repair cost on a Subaru is high? Easiest car to work on in my opinion. Fuel filter? Attached with a handy dandy bracket N clip right under the hood. Changed out in 45 seconds. Oil filter? Right in front and accessible without even jacking the car up (if stock height). Brakes? cake walk. Roof rails on the wagon...buy Yak towers and cross bars FTW. Its a rack set actually designed to haul sh1t....imagine that. AWD in our winters = bad@ss...subaru's AWD system is the best, hands down. Especially for the sticker price.
My advice: Look for like a 2005 Subaru WRX wagon. Throw the Yak stuff on it and be done. Have a car that gets 26-28mpg on the freeway, plenty of power, can be had for a good price with low miles...
Here is a 2002 in Madison with only 64k on the ticker WITH a Yakima rack.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1392579
Rocket Power
10-16-2008, 01:02 PM
The Ford Flex looks like a roomy as heck fuel pincher, give them a look.
17/24 doesn't seem to fuel pincher-ish to me
Crawlin
10-16-2008, 01:04 PM
and they can even carry a powerglide transmission in the back NO PROBS!!! I SEEN IT!@
jbiscuit
10-16-2008, 01:10 PM
and they can even carry a powerglide transmission in the back NO PROBS!!! I SEEN IT!@
with room to spare! :wooo
Waver
10-16-2008, 01:19 PM
The Ford Flex looks like a roomy as heck fuel pincher, give them a look.
he dosnt want a ford, and dosnt want the price tag that a flex comes with
Its not working on them that I'm worried about, its paying for parts. Whats a car like that get for city fuel mileage?
jbiscuit
10-16-2008, 01:23 PM
I average 24-25 with city/highway mixed driving. Pork what parts are expensive that you are referring to?
I don't know, I honestly forgot you have one of these wagons Jason. I just thought that in general, Subaru parts were more expensive? 10 grand isn't bad
jbiscuit
10-16-2008, 01:36 PM
in my findings, the parts prices have been "fair." Ultimately, its all about finding a car you can live with. I bought the wagon new Nov. 2002 and can't find too many reasons to part with it. Its been a GREAT car. Awesome for camping trips, adding the rack allows hauling bikes, snowboards etc, the rear seats fold down and you can haul a TON of sh1t in there...plus like Gino said as well as I, one winter and you are hooked. They are a LOT of fun in the snow.
My problem lies with getting rid of my truck since I can't seem to sell it for the life of me. Apparently 12,900 is asking too much, I haven't even had any offers. I gotta move the truck before I do anything, that's why I was looking at dealerships so I could at least trade it in.
False promises from most dealers anyways, Hall might give me what I want for it but they have nothing on their lot that interests me.
CobraSnake
10-16-2008, 01:39 PM
My problem lies with getting rid of my truck since I can't seem to sell it for the life of me. Apparently 12,900 is asking too much, I haven't even had any offers. I gotta move the truck before I do anything, that's why I was looking at dealerships so I could at least trade it in.
False promises from most dealers anyways, Hall might give me what I want for it but they have nothing on their lot that interests me.
Ask them if they will just buy it then. Or will you only get that deal if you buy something from them??
Ask them if they will just buy it then. Or will you only get that deal if you buy something from them??
I did, I actually just got off the phone with the used car guy. Hopefully he calls me back with good news.
CobraSnake
10-16-2008, 01:49 PM
I did, I actually just got off the phone with the used car guy. Hopefully he calls me back with good news.
I just ask because I sold my focus SVT to a ford dealer. They even let me take the rims off and put the dented stock ones back on. They offered me a price over the phone even.
Mark
WhatsADSM
10-16-2008, 02:07 PM
Definitely a fan of the subaru wagon. Thats a pretty good choice.
Not sure if you are willing to consider mopar, but the new caliber seems like it would fit the bill. Plenty big, good gas mileage, I would assume roof rack capable?! They are onyl a year or 2 old most with less than 20k miles on them for around $10k.
Damn near every vehicle made will support a roof rack, minus the hhr for some strange ass reason.
slo_evo
10-16-2008, 02:13 PM
This MP5 is better looking,practical , and dependable:rolf
http://www.arizonaresponsesystems.com/smith/hk/hk01.jpg
Both MP5's are practical and dependable, both can easily kill if put in the wrong hands, both have a decent capacity but low-power.
One will get you laid, the other will get you unlaid...
slo_evo
10-16-2008, 02:15 PM
The Ford Flex looks like a roomy as heck fuel pincher, give them a look.
24mpg is fuel pinching?
Waver
10-16-2008, 02:33 PM
24mpg is fuel pinching?
for somthing of its size....yeah it is
lordairgtar
10-16-2008, 06:11 PM
You have both? What year xB? The new ones are much improved over the first gens, the cabin is MUCH quieter and a bit larger then the first gens to from all the reviews I have been reading.
An 06. My stepdaughter has it.
lordairgtar
10-16-2008, 06:19 PM
Damn near every vehicle made will support a roof rack, minus the hhr for some strange ass reason.
I don't know why that is. I have seen racks and carriers on HHRs on the road. Is it weight or wind resistance? I do know that bicycles fit pretty good inside. I have the panel version...no windows!
Both weight and wind resistance, people do load them but using the factory roof rack voids the warranty.
If you like the 06, you gotta drive one of the new ones. I rode in a buddys 1st gen a while back, and the new ones are totally re-designed vehicles.
wrath
10-16-2008, 07:45 PM
What is preventing you from using a small purpose-built trailer? Probably get a ton better gas mileage than carrying a sheet of plywood on the roof.
Space, although I didn't really think of that till now. That might be an option.
Ever look at a Pontiac Vibe? 30+ mpg and more room than most SUVs.
FYI- those Saabs come in a non-turbo variant.
wrath
10-16-2008, 10:04 PM
Space, although I didn't really think of that till now. That might be an option.
My Dad has a purpose-built trailer for his canoes. It makes it a lot more convenient as far a speed to go (he just leaves the canoes on the trailer with a tarp over them) and he can tow it with his 4 banger YJ. I know you're looking for a house and whatnot so if you've got a place to store one until then I think you'd be happier. It'd open up a lot more vehicles. It's kind of a PITA to tow a trailer with a small underpowered FWD vehicle though.
I bought one of those soft rooftop carriers from Chris he had a while back for the top of my parents' Tahoe. It costs them a solid mile per gallon. That's like 5%. With the hitch hauler it costs them nothing. Towing a small trailer the same width and height as the Tahoe costs them nothing.
Ever look at a Pontiac Vibe? 30+ mpg and more room than most SUVs.
They're kind of underpowered. But, they're a good people hauler. A person I work with has one and I kind of like it (it's an 07). I almost bought one instead of the G6 last fall but they're just too underpowered. They're just as roomy in the back as the G6 but a little less room in the front. The G5 (coupe) has like 35 more horses, less weight, and gets the same gas mileage on the highway but I get a lot better city (G5 is a 2.2L manual, his 1.nothing is a slushbox)... but the G5's back seat is essentially worthless. Even the dog doesn't like riding back there.
Vibe GT has 180, a 6 speed, and still gets 30 mpg.
Exitspeed
10-17-2008, 09:20 AM
For a car like this I'd be more concerned with MPG and practicality then it being underpowered.
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