This local story has me fired up

[Karps TA]

from jsonline


Life sentence for Racine man in shooting

Racine - Spurning a call for leniency, a judge decided today that Adrial White should get a life sentence for shooting at three people who were trying to break into his girlfriend's car, killing one of them.

In his ruling, Racine County Circuit Judge Charles Constantine dropped one count against White, of Racine, but sentenced him to life plus five years for the fatal shooting and 20 years, with 10 years of that sentence to be served in prison, for wounding a second man. The sentences will run concurrent.

Circuit Judge Charles Constantine issued the ruling after hearing testimony from White's supporters who said he was a good family man who was trying to prevent a crime and shouldn't be harshly punished. They had collected petitions asking the judge for leniency. He also heard from the victims' families.

White was found guilty in November of first-degree intentional homicide in the shooting death of Christopher "Eric" Carbajal, 19. He was also found guilty of attempted second-degree intentional homicide and attempted first-degree reckless homicide, both of which were reduced by the jury, for shooting at two other young men, seriously wounding one of them.

The shootings, which occurred outside of White's house early Jan. 18, 2006, divided parts of the community, with some saying White is a hero for protecting property and taking action against crime, and others, including prosecutors, saying he exceeded his legal right to use lethal force.

Nice to know the State cares more about the criminals. IMO the only thing this guy did wrong was not killing all 3 of the thieves.

Maybe if more were shot, they'd think twice about taking other peoples stuff.

[0TransAm0]

i was also pissed that they found him guilty. i think its bullshit but i guess the law is the law.. damn low life thieves deserved it.

[juicedimpss]

i think it would have been ruled differently if they were breaking into his home,not his car.

[wikked]

life sentence! wtf... and OJ is a free man...

[Karps TA]

I want to know what the thieves got for sentencing. Probably a fine and probation.

[Korndogg]

I want to know what the thieves got for sentencing. Probably a fine and probation.


extra welfare checks.

[hrsp]

thats a bunch of BS.....

[73Dustr]

I think I disagree with most of you. Don't get me wrong, I think we should have the right to protect property and our homes. In fact, I think it was last summer certain state legislatures tried introducing the "Castle Doctrine" which would allow just that. It would allow citizens to beat the hell out of intruders in their home without having to worry about being charged with criminal offenses or lawsuits from the intruder. It's a shame that bill never made it into law, but look how certain legislatures stand on similar issues like concealed carry.

Back to the topic, if this guy were an honest citizen, why did he hide the gun and hesitate to call the police? If someone broke into my house I'd act the same way this guy did, but I wouldn't stash the gun, I'd call the police immediately. Also, did this guy have any criminal background? That could sway the jury as well. Just my opinion.

[jeep srt8]

from jsonline



Nice to know the State cares more about the criminals. IMO the only thing this guy did wrong was not killing all 3 of the thieves.

Maybe if more were shot, they'd think twice about taking other peoples stuff.

maybe we should get the survivors to repeatedly break into the judges car; lets see how the judge feels about that.:flipoff2:

[Karps TA]

Back to the topic, if this guy were an honest citizen, why did he hide the gun and hesitate to call the police? If someone broke into my house I'd act the same way this guy did, but I wouldn't stash the gun, I'd call the police immediately. Also, did this guy have any criminal background? That could sway the jury as well. Just my opinion.

I dunno, younger black male, handgun, cops. If I was in his shoes I probably would have been worried about the cops railroading me as well. Lots of people don't trust the police. Many times for good reasons.

The comment "He also heard from the victims' families." What the hell could those families say that would have any bearing on the case? They told the jury how good there kid was? How they raised him so well that he's stealing peoples crap? The police should have cited the families for being complete failures at raising decent human beings who respect others people stuff.

[Reverend Cooper]

ya cant run around out side shootin people like its the ok corral i mean really wtf thats just as dumb as the ****er that was stealing. now come in my house and take shit i will shoot your ass,and drag your body back in if my 45 pushed you out the door

[Flicktitty]

i saw that on the news at work today and me and my Boss both said how shitty that was.

[Yooformula]

Back to the topic, if this guy were an honest citizen, why did he hide the gun and hesitate to call the police? If someone broke into my house I'd act the same way this guy did, but I wouldn't stash the gun, I'd call the police immediately. Also, did this guy have any criminal background? That could sway the jury as well. Just my opinion.


Thats not all he did...why did he pick up all of his shells and hide them? why were the guys shot in the back from a distance?

[pOrk]

Cause they were stealing the 12 pounds of cocaine from his car :-P

If I had a gun, and saw someone breaking into my car, I would shoot their ankles out and hope they had to spend the rest of their life in a wheel chair.

Hard to steal someones stereo when you gotta jump into your car, then fold up your chair and squeeze it into the backseat before speeding away

[Flicktitty]

:durr :rolf OMFG :rolf :durr
Cause they were stealing the 12 pounds of cocaine from his car :-P

If I had a gun, and saw someone breaking into my car, I would shoot their ankles out and hope they had to spend the rest of their life in a wheel chair.

Hard to steal someones stereo when you gotta jump into your car, then fold up your chair and squeeze it into the backseat before speeding away

[Al]

I believe it is right to protect your property, but I am wondering how he shot the second one.

Shooting one of them seems reasonable, but I wonder if the other one was hit in the back. I bet he was running after the first friend went down or he was on his knees begging for his life.

I'd call it overkill. . . pun intended.

[subliminal1284]

I dont think he should of gotten life for it but I do believe he should have some punishment. I could see maybe if he was in the car and they were trying to break in but if someone is just breaking into your car your life is in no immediate danger, He should of fired shots into the air which would of just scared them off. If they were breaking into his house then I would have to say they got what they deserved. But with dumbf*cks like doyle in place im sure alot of crazy sentences like this will happen. When I was back in florida some guy tried to rob a pharmacy and the pharmacist shot the guy dead, Since the guy felt threatened they didnt do a damn thing.

[fireguyrick]

My opinion is that he made the wrong choice. I know that we all hate thieves, but that is no reason to kill someone. After all, that is what insurance is suppose to be used for. Breaking into your house is different, as there you have no clear idea what the intentions of the home invader is, but a car man? Let see, stealing my car = threat to my physical safety? I think not. I am SURE there is more to it then what the Milwaukee Urinal Sentinal printed.

Rick

[Berettaspeed]

al i have to say is my first two rounds are blanks, 3rd is snake shot then they're live baby. if your ass is not gone by the first 2 your going to get hurt.


thats messed up they gave him life.. maybe 5yrs or somthing, but common not life. i think this guy was being used as an example.

[HAMRHEAD]

If it were my car I would have wanted to execute them as well. However as a lawbiding citizen I have to follow the law or I'm no better. Deadly force is only allowed to protect life or serious bdily injury. Or PR1 and 2 government resources. But personal property cannot be protected with deadly force. I don't agree as I hate thieves! Yet I have no choice. His sentence is just as stupid as those crimes though. Life? WTF ever!

[Yooformula]

it wasnt his car. it was his girlfriend's car and they were already done with it by the time he came out. he shot them in the back as they were running then tried to cover it up by removing all of the casings. This guy was just as guilty as they were IMO.

[PureSound15]

I don't know the whole story, and no stereo is worth taking someones life for. After all, by taking that mans life he has now caused his children to grow up fatherless which is sad no matter which side of the fence you're on IMO. I doubt anyone will argue that.

[Yooformula]

I do agree that the thieves brought it on themselves by initiating the burglery BUT the facts are that this guy should serve time maybe not life but he in no way is a hero.

1. the thieves were 3 blocks from his house. he heard car alarms and jumped out hoping to catch someone
2. he lied to cops and cleaned up the scene of shells and a shoe that belonged to the victim
3. he never called the cops yet cops were blocks away responding to the alarms already and they testified that he told them that they didnt see anything.
4. he had previously been charged with battery against his wife so its not like he doesnt have a temper
5. they were unarmed so there was no threat to his life
6. oh yeah, they were down the street when he shot them!!!


again, he should serve jail time. maybe not life but its should be something considerable. and those kids should get jail time also. the real crime is that the kids were never charged with anything.

[TheBlueSupra]

I want to know what the thieves got for sentencing. Probably a fine and probation.


This happend two blocks from my house.

they havent been brought to court yet.

and the idiot got what was coming to him he has been in and outa jail for awhile now. he shouldnt have shot him in the back the kid was running away. shoulda shot him in the chest and there woulda been a different story i bet.

[88Nightmare]

Yeah im gonna have to say this guy used excessive violence. Its just a radio. But like others said, if theives were breaking into his house, then yeah, you may feel the need to open fire. Funny with this case is how more and more facts seem to be surfacing, like how the theives were a few blocks away already when he shot them.
This guy definitely deserves jail time. Life may seem a bit extreme. Every time I turn on the news and see someone getting sentenced for a crime, it always seems that the punishment never fits the crime. I recall cases of self defense where the defender has received 10 years, but the attacker doesn't get charged? wtf kind of garbage is that?

[73Dustr]

I recall cases of self defense where the defender has received 10 years, but the attacker doesn't get charged? wtf kind of garbage is that?

Welcome to Wisconsin. Like I mentioned earlier, it's a damn shame that Castle Doctrine never made it through into a law. I agree with Yoo. The guy used excessive force and deserves to serve time. As far as life being too much, I don't know, I'm kind of on the fence for that one. He tried to cover the whole incident up. In my opinion, that just makes him another criminal. Like many of you guys said, had these guys broke into his house it'd be different. Then again, under current laws, he could've still been charged or sued unless he could easily prove his life or someone else's was in danger. In my opinion, that's bull because the minute an intruder breaks into your home who knows what the hell their intent is.

[SpdRcrZ]

Revisiting...... and I never weighed in on this the first time around.

Adrial White was granted a new trial. A Judge decided that Adrial's lawyer didn't do a good enough job defending him. :flipoff2:


Thats not all he did...why did he pick up all of his shells and hide them? why were the guys shot in the back from a distance?

it wasnt his car. it was his girlfriend's car and they were already done with it by the time he came out. he shot them in the back as they were running then tried to cover it up by removing all of the casings. This guy was just as guilty as they were IMO.

I do agree that the thieves brought it on themselves by initiating the burglery BUT the facts are that this guy should serve time maybe not life but he in no way is a hero.

1. the thieves were 3 blocks from his house. he heard car alarms and jumped out hoping to catch someone
2. he lied to cops and cleaned up the scene of shells and a shoe that belonged to the victim
3. he never called the cops yet cops were blocks away responding to the alarms already and they testified that he told them that they didnt see anything.
4. he had previously been charged with battery against his wife so its not like he doesnt have a temper
5. they were unarmed so there was no threat to his life
6. oh yeah, they were down the street when he shot them!!!

again, he should serve jail time. maybe not life but its should be something considerable. and those kids should get jail time also. the real crime is that the kids were never charged with anything.

Couple of things about this thread. Christopher "Eric" Carbajal was shot at pretty close range (gun powder found on the back of his shirt), and from the first trial, he "possibly" was laying on the ground when fatally shot. The other two where shot at, also in the back, from a greater distance. One had 3-4 bullet holes in his shirts and pants, the other took a round to the jaw (entered the rear/side, exited the front).

Thieves suck. We all know this. I've had 2 cars broken into, and my snowblower stolen...... and although I would have loved to catch them doing it, I would never shoot at A) someone running from me, B) an un-armed person, C) anyone who is not threatening myself, my wife, or my child.

None of the parties involved where outstanding or model citizens of Racine (or Wisconsin). The 3 are guilty of stealing someone else's property, Adrial stole a LIFE and attempted to steal 2 others! Eric paid the ultimate price, his life. The other two had to watch their friend, cousin, and brother die (Eric's brother was driving the van they where in, his cousin was one of the ones shot at).

Adrial deserves to pay to the fullest extent of the law. He did not have to pick up a gun and go outside to confront them. Call the Police maybe? Follow them? Or empty your gun into their backs as they ran? (PS. Shooting into the air is a VERY STUPID thing to do as well...... remember, what goes up, must come down!)

I'm not against guns, I'm not against protecting myself and my loved ones. I AM against taking a life over a crappy stereo. I AM against idiots giving law makers one more excuse why WI cant have CC.

Eric Carbajal was my wife's cousin. I only met him a few times. He was not perfect, but then again, none of us are. I'm not. I stole a deck once. I ended up getting fingered for it. I took accountability for my auctions. I paid the consequences for my auctions. I was stupid. I learned my lesson, and I would like to think I'm a better person for it. My point? They where young, they made bad choices. We ALL DO!

I want to know what the thieves got for sentencing. Probably a fine and probation.Eric paid with his life, the others paid more then any stereo could ever be worth. How can anyone justify a life for a stereo? I do however think the others deserve to be held accountable for the thefts.

Look into your own lives...... think of something you did stupid. Street Racing, Stealing, Trespassing, Running a Red Light, Drinking and Driving....... is it ok for someone to take your life for that? Should we let Adrial go with a slap on the wrist and a box of ammo? I'm glad the first Jury didn't think so, and I'm hoping the second wont either. As far as sentencing goes, "you do the crime, you pay the time". He intentionally picked up the gun, walked outside, and fired it at un-armed fleeing people. That is an utter disregard for human life. Any of those rounds could have also entered any of the neighboring houses and wounded and killed someone NOT breaking into his G/F's car. Would you still be standing by Adrial then?

[nitrous]

^ Liberal.


None of the parties involved where outstanding or model citizens of Racine

False

I grew up with some of the carbajal family and even worked with one of them. The two I grew up with were constantly in trouble at school and the one I worked with lost his six figure job for stealing company time.

I don't agree that he was right in shoothing them. I think he should have at least caught one and and done a little torturing to him. And people think the thumbscrew device on my wall is just for show...

Everyone can throw out different scenarios, but in the end, that wasn't how it was played out. How certain would you have been they were unarmed? You're shaking, adrenaline flowing, and until any of you have been in the same situation, please do not draw out irrational motives from your semantics.

[pOrk]

Holy old thread batman.

Criminals have more rights, its the sad truth. I think all parties got what they had coming, minus the guy that lost his life. BUT, thats a risk he took by trying to take what didn't belong to him.

[Rocket Power]

Like was said earlier you can not in WI use deadly force to defend property, you must reasonably believe you are in danger of imminent death or great bodily harm. He was defending property,mistake1, shooting people as they were leaving, thus ending any imminent threat there may have been, was mistake two.
Sucks for the dude, but that's the law.

[Windsors 03 Cobra]

The shooter was a pretty big cat and the chavs were just little sticks he should have just beat them within inches of their lives.
But he killed a man and while thats crime that may be worth 20 years in this case, IMO. Not life.

Life use to be 17 years before truth in sentencing I believe.

[SpdRcrZ]

^ Liberal.

False

I grew up with some of the carbajal family and even worked with one of them. The two I grew up with were constantly in trouble at school and the one I worked with lost his six figure job for stealing company time.

I don't agree that he was right in shoothing them. I think he should have at least caught one and and done a little torturing to him. And people think the thumbscrew device on my wall is just for show...

Everyone can throw out different scenarios, but in the end, that wasn't how it was played out. How certain would you have been they were unarmed? You're shaking, adrenaline flowing, and until any of you have been in the same situation, please do not draw out irrational motives from your semantics.

liberal? why, because I dont believe death is a fitting punishment for stealing?

false? You completely backed my point......
None of the parties involved where outstanding or model citizens of Racine (or Wisconsin)
BUT what does "Other" Carbajal's have to do with their actions? My wife is a Carbajal, she's never even had a traffic ticket.

I said I wouldnt shoot them..... never said I wouldnt kick the shit out of them if I caught them.

The point is to think before you act...... thats what "scenarios" are all about..... thats what Cops train for. Hell, you learn that much in Hunter Safety. You cant understand that, you have no business handling a fire arm.

If I feared they might be armed, I stay my ass in the house and call the COPS. I've been in a few scary situations, never once was my first thought "I should grab my gun and start shooting". And what the fuck does
please do not draw out irrational motives from your semantics. mean anyway?!?!



The shooter was a pretty big cat and the chavs were just little sticks he should have just beat them within inches of their lives.
But he killed a man and while thats crime that may be worth 20 years in this case, IMO. Not life.

Life use to be 17 years before truth in sentencing I believe.

His sentence was Life with the possibility of parole (supervised release) after 25 I believe.

[Poncho]

ya cant run around out side shootin people like its the ok corral i mean really wtf thats just as dumb as the ****er that was stealing. now come in my house and take shit i will shoot your ass,and drag your body back in if my 45 pushed you out the door

so his mistake was not putting the bodies in his car?

[Breecher_7]

so his mistake was not putting the bodies in his car?

His mistake was not burying the bodies..... :rolf

[Poncho]

His mistake was not burying the bodies..... :rolf


can't shovel through concrete, it ain't the country like us hicks, ya know. :-)

[Karps TA]

Wow, back from the dead. My stance hasn't changed. You wanna be a thief and steal from people who worked to pay for the things they have, then the possibility of you losing your life doing it, is all part of the experience. Don't want to get shot to death, don't take stuff that doesn't belong to you.

Had these jacklegs been just held until the cops got there, they would have got a night in jail, and a slap on the wrist and would have been out stealing crap again by the end of the week ruining more people lives. If this guy's family cared about him so much maybe they wouldn't of raised such a POS to begin with.

[jbiscuit]

I went to school with Adrial White and his sister Edwina in Racine. He was a good guy from what I remember. I think he was trying to protect his sh1t and like said much earlier, I think he realized that the situation would get ugly...young black man + gun + shooting = almost definite conviction. I agree he should have handled the scenerio much better. IE don't try and hide the gun etc. But don't you think adrenalin would play a part in all this? Don't you think that he maybe could SEE the outcome of all this? I do agree that a life should not be lost over property but at the same time we should have rights to defend our property. He should have shot for the legs and then thrown in a few sucker punches to get the point across or something. I can tell you that if a thief was in my house and put my wife or I in danger, I would do what I saw was necessary to protect her/I.....granted, this was breaking into a car but still. Our laws defend criminals and its sad.

[STANMAN]

The only problem I have is that he tried to hide it and cover it up. There is no tears in my eyes for the person that died over a stereo or the other two that got shot, not one. Messages like this need to be sent to every criminal. I have heard some say "it's just a stereo", well, that may be true, but if we use that argument, where do we stop?? Hey, it's just money, hey, it's just your car, hey, it's just your wifes pvssy the guy was raping. Is pvssy worth a life, I mean pvssy is alot cheaper than a car stereo!!!! It's the principal behind being robbed, and if you start putting some sort of monetary value on a criminals life, it's a slippery slope in my mind. Would it have changed if the car were in the guys garage instead of just his driveway?? To me, if you're on my land and attempting to steal/rape/harm my family, you're getting EXACTLY what this guy got, only there wouldn't be 2 survivors to try to sue me after the fact.

[84hurst]

The comment "He also heard from the victims' families." What the hell could those families say that would have any bearing on the case? They told the jury how good there kid was? How they raised him so well that he's stealing peoples crap? The police should have cited the families for being complete failures at raising decent human beings who respect others people stuff.
QFMFT!

In my opinion, the guy had every right to protect his property. I would've done the same thing. That guy deserves an award for successful crime prevention. :thumbsup

[73Dustr]

The only problem I have is that he tried to hide it and cover it up.

I agree. Plus the fact that he shot them in the back. Had he approached them and they were shot from the front, it might be different. As for those that said an a$$ beating would be okay, what's to say the perps aren't armed? Especially in this day and age where criminals have no regard human life and kill anyone that gets in their way.

I think he did the right thing by grabbing the gun to confront them, but actually shooting them as they fled was a mistake. I think it would be interesting to see how this scenario would play out in state like Texas that has a Castle Doctrine allowing individuals to protect property.

A similar incident happened there last year and there was a lot of controversy. Once again, the perps were shot in the back. The one happened to be an illegal citizen with a criminal background. It's still interesting to listen to the entire 911 call. I would like having this guy as my neighbor:

Please be aware there is some graphic language/sounds (shots being fired) and might not be safe for work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLtKCC7z0yc

I hate to say it, but if a lot more criminals got shot while committing crime, I think crime rates would decrease. I have done a lot of research on concealed carry and the same principle stands. You allow law-abiding citizens to arm themselvs, criminals think twice. But, we live in Wisconsin so I digress.

[Windsors 03 Cobra]

Yea that was a good call, I wouldnt have shot the punks stealing my stereo as I dont have a gun and I dont even want to spend 1 night in the clink.

[PB86MCSS]

They where young, they made bad choices. We ALL DO!

We all don't commit crimes or steal from other people....a speeding ticket is different from theft. The above sounds like justifying what they thieves did.

Not saying he doesn't deserve to do some time or punished in some way (I'll admit I haven't followed the case as much as some others have) but I have a hard time faulting anyone from protecting their own property from scumbags...yes thats what they are if they are trying to steal. I've had items stolen as well as many others on here I'm sure, while I don't own a gun and would like to think I wouldn't shoot/kill anyone, you bet I'd beat the crap out of them if given the chance. And I've never done anything violent in my life....but theives are near the bottom of the scum-pole and deserve it. JMHO, YMMV :) .

[flyin_blue_egg]

the only time you are allowed to use force is to protect YOURSELF! meaning you must feel threatened....if they are breaking into your car and you're inside your home, then there's no possible way you could feel threatened....yea it sucks but technically you have to wait until they break into your home, and then even you can't just go killing them. if they break in but are unarmed then you can't kill them eiter.

[lordairgtar]

Thats not all he did...why did he pick up all of his shells and hide them? why were the guys shot in the back from a distance?
A good shooter will always police his rounds.:D

[tommyt5078]

the only time you are allowed to use force is to protect YOURSELF! meaning you must feel threatened....if they are breaking into your car and you're inside your home, then there's no possible way you could feel threatened....yea it sucks but technically you have to wait until they break into your home, and then even you can't just go killing them. if they break in but are unarmed then you can't kill them eiter.


Wow we are all different, If I was in my house and someone was breaking into my chit I would feel threatened, and yes I would feel like my life is being threatened.

How can you not feel threatened when someone breaks into your chit?

[Rocket Power]

Wow we are all different, If I was in my house and someone was breaking into my chit I would feel threatened, and yes I would feel like my life is being threatened.

How can you not feel threatened when someone breaks into your chit?

Good luck convincing a jury that you feared for your life because someone was stealing your stereo outside from your car, and left when you came out

[lordairgtar]

I mean pvssy is alot cheaper than a car stereo!!!!
Not if you are married to it:D

[STANMAN]

Good luck convincing a jury that you feared for your life because someone was stealing your stereo outside from your car, and left when you came out

I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6. You think in todays world that if you bust in on someone trying to steal your car radio that they wouldn't shoot you? What color is the sky in your world? I mean people get trampled to death for $5 off on a dvd player for Gods sake, and that's just from other "normal" people, now imagine a person that thinks so little of you that they are willing to steal your shit, do you think they give two squirts of monkey piss about your life?????:rolf

[STANMAN]

Not if you are married to it:D

= troof

[Rocket Power]

I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6. You think in todays world that if you bust in on someone trying to steal your car radio that they wouldn't shoot you? What color is the sky in your world? I mean people get trampled to death for $5 off on a dvd player for Gods sake, and that's just from other "normal" people, now imagine a person that thinks so little of you that they are willing to steal your shit, do you think they give two squirts of monkey piss about your life?????:rolf

I am not saying they couldn't be dangerous/threatening, but shooting at them while they are leaving makes it hard to prove they were threatening you. I don't write the laws. I just try not to end up on the wrong side of them:thumbsup

[SpdRcrZ]

You wanna be a thief and steal from people who worked to pay for the things they have, then the possibility of you losing your life doing it, is all part of the experience. Don't want to get shot to death, don't take stuff that doesn't belong to you.

Had these jacklegs been just held until the cops got there, they would have got a night in jail, and a slap on the wrist and would have been out stealing crap again by the end of the week ruining more people lives. If this guy's family cared about him so much maybe they wouldn't of raised such a POS to begin with.
Stealing isnt a crime punished by death. Murder should be, and is in some states.
So is Adrial's parents to blame for his dis-regard for human life?

Don't you think that he maybe could SEE the outcome of all this?

I can tell you that if a thief was in my house and put my wife or I in danger, I would do what I saw was necessary to protect her/I.....granted, this was breaking into a car but still. Our laws defend criminals and its sad.
If he could "see" the outcome, why did he pull the trigger? It probably went more like this.....

*Ring*
Sup dawg?
Shit igger, I just capped some fooz breaking into my bitches ride dawg!
No Shit?
Hellz yea! best respect a igger!
Thats ma igger right there! Thats how we do a fooz! Dawg, u butter pick up ur brazz and hide the gat, cause the fuzz going to be bustin ur door soon, igger!
No shit? ur right! I best hide this shit, good looking out! Halla at yooz later dawg*Click*

If they where in your house, and posing a threat to you or a loved one, then yes. Defend yourself. But when their outside, not a threat to your life, dont take it upon yourself to play a tough guy and start shooting.

Messages like this need to be sent to every criminal. I have heard some say "it's just a stereo", well, that may be true, but if we use that argument, where do we stop?? Hey, it's just money, hey, it's just your car, hey, it's just your wifes pvssy the guy was raping. Is pvssy worth a life, I mean pvssy is alot cheaper than a car stereo!!!! It's the principal behind being robbed, and if you start putting some sort of monetary value on a criminals life, it's a slippery slope in my mind. Would it have changed if the car were in the guys garage instead of just his driveway?? To me, if you're on my land and attempting to steal/rape/harm my family, you're getting EXACTLY what this guy got, only there wouldn't be 2 survivors to try to sue me after the fact.
There are laws for a reason. By your reasoning, you can shoot anyone for being a "potential" threat? The strange guy ringing the door bell, trying to "get out the vote"? The door to door bible thumper? The HS kid selling magazines? The freaking girl scout selling cookies, or the neighbor kid riding his bike threw your yard? Any of them "could" have a gun. Any of them "could" want to steal your hustler collection. Any of them "could" want to rape your wife (although I dont know anyone that hard up for sex... well, other then you....) ......... Shoot first, ask questions later? Is that a bumper sticker on your car?


In my opinion, the guy had every right to protect his property. I would've done the same thing. That guy deserves an award for successful crime prevention. :thumbsup
The "Crime" had already been committed. A misdemeanor at that..... he played Judge, Jury, and Executioner. While doing so, he committed more heinace crimes then the 3 stealing the stereo, but yet he's your hero? I bet you would have let Dahmer free too!

what's to say the perps aren't armed? Especially in this day and age where criminals have no regard human life and kill anyone that gets in their way.
I guess thats the risk you take when you decide to take law enforcement into your own hands. "criminals have no regard human life and kill anyone", sounds like a fitting description for Adrial right there!

When I lived in Waukesha, I heard someone breaking into a car outside. First thing I did? Woke my wife and told her to call the cops. The second thing I did, grabbed my baseball bat and went outside to confront him. I took a risk. The car wasn't mine. I didn't know who's it was. In my case, turned out it was a drunk who locked himself out of his car, and broke the rear hatch window to get back in (mazda mx3, his buddy was passed out in the passenger seat!). Did I start swinging before asking questions? No, I waited with him for the cops to show up and do their job.

We have Cops for a reason. You dont think their doing a good enough job? Get your ass off the couch, go to school, and get a badge pined to your shirt . At least then when you shoot some un-armed criminal, you can get paid leave while waiting for the inquest.


I hate to say it, but if a lot more criminals got shot while committing crime, I think crime rates would decrease. I have done a lot of research on concealed carry and the same principle stands. You allow law-abiding citizens to arm themselves, criminals think twice. But, we live in Wisconsin so I digress.
So Cops should just shoot, instead of arrest?
And you think Adrial is a good candidate for CC? A "law-abiding citizen"? A good candidate for CC is one who knows right from wrong. One that can use good judgment in a time of crisis. From what I've seen, most here do not fit that requirement. I'm shocked a lot of you passed hunter safety.

Again, I do NOT CONDONE THE ACTIONS of the thief's. I do however believe we should be held accountable for our actions. I don't make the laws, or the consequences/punishments that enforce them, I just try not to put myself into any situation where I need to keep my asshole clinched for long periods of time :shades

(I've never been arrested, and my only non-traffic ticket was a trespassing ticket when I was 18..... hell, I've only been in handcuff's once, and that was for the "Officer's Safety")

One last thing...... as far as being a Liberal.....


A liberal supports many of the following political positions and practices.

* Taxpayer-funded and/or legalized abortion I AM ProChoice, but not Pro Abortion
* Censorship of teacher-lead prayer in classrooms and school sponsored events I'm not Anti-God....
* Support for gun control I am PRO Gun
* Support of obscenity and pornography as a First Amendment right I do love my Porn
* Income redistribution, usually through progressive taxation I believe in working for your own money
* Government-rationed medical care, such as Universal Health Care I hate paying for Health Care, but its a part of life
* Taxpayer-funded and government-controlled public education I hate paying for my kids Daycare, can't wait till she starts K4!
* The denial of inherent gender differences Boys have penises, Girls have Vaginas
* Insisting that men and women have the same access to jobs in the military Do they? No. Should they? Yes.
* Legalized same-sex marriage I could care less. What ever makes them happy
* Implementation of affirmative action :rolleyes:
* Political correctness :flipoff2:
* Support of labor unions I just started my first union job.... but I've always been anti-union
* Teaching acceptance of promiscuity through sexual "education" rather than teaching abstinence from sex. Ignorance is bliss, right? :durr
* A "living Constitution" that is reinterpreted as liberals prefer, rather than how it was intended The Constitution should have been written in stone.
* Government programs to rehabilitate criminals Crime and Punishment
* Abolition of the death penalty Murder and Rape = Death
* Environmentalism Save a life, plant a tree?
* Disarmament treaties Those with guns save themselves
* Globalism :punch:
* Opposition to an interventionalist American foreign policy Sometimes you need a strong hand
* In 2005, it was reported by CBS News that liberals were the most likely supporters of the theory of evolution. The theory of evolution is a key component of atheistic ideologies in the Western World. I believe in the Theory of Evolution
* Opposition to domestic wire-tapping as authorized in the Patriot Act If you have nothing to hide, why worry?
* Calling anyone they agree with a "professor" regardless of whether he earned that distinction based on a real peer review of his work (see, e.g., Richard Dawkins and Barack Obama). I didn't vote for Obama

Liberalism is a political philosophy with freedom as its core value. The term was originally applied to supporters of individual liberties and equal rights, but, in America, the term has come to represent a movement of social change that often conflicts with conservative values such as moral values and tradition.

Democrats and many media outlets in the U.S. are often liberal. I voted for Bush..... twice, but I dont consider myself Republican.

Liberalism is a broad class of political philosophies that consider individual liberty to be the most important political goal.
Liberalism emphasizes individual rights and equality of opportunity.

The first modern liberal state was the United States of America, founded on the principle that "all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness; that to insure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed."

In the United States, the party system wasn't developed based on strong ideological differences, for example, the Democrats of the South have traditionally been right wing, while northern Democrats are traditionally left wing, although particularly since the 1970s the Democrats in general have tended more to the left and Republicans to the right. Ideologically, all major US parties are Liberal and always have been. Essentially they follow classic liberalism, merging constitutionalism with free markets and centering the differences on the influences of social liberalism.
Social liberalism may also refer, as it usually does in North American media, simply to support for educational reform, civil rights, human rights, and civil liberties. In this sense, one could be socially liberal and economically conservative (often referred to as economic liberalism), as is the case with those called variously classical liberals, neoliberals, libertarians, and conservative liberals/liberal conservatives.

[pOrk]

^ I'm not even going to reply to that thread, BLATANT racism ruins any form of intelligent debate. Good job!

[STANMAN]

There are laws for a reason. By your reasoning, you can shoot anyone for being a "potential" threat? The strange guy ringing the door bell, trying to "get out the vote"? The door to door bible thumper? The HS kid selling magazines? The freaking girl scout selling cookies, or the neighbor kid riding his bike threw your yard? Any of them "could" have a gun. Any of them "could" want to steal your hustler collection. Any of them "could" want to rape your wife (although I dont know anyone that hard up for sex... well, other then you....) ......... Shoot first, ask questions later? Is that a bumper sticker on your car?





I am not married, yet. And I personally think I did quiet well for myself thank you!!! But on to the bumper sticker, FYI it actually reads "Kill them all and let God sort them out!":rolf

[Nick]

Death for breaking into a car - ridiculous.
A few warning shots would have been enough.

[73Dustr]

I guess thats the risk you take when you decide to take law enforcement into your own hands. "criminals have no regard human life and kill anyone", sounds like a fitting description for Adrial right there!

If you read any of my previous posts, I didn't like the way this whole situation went down. Shooting as they fled and hiding the evidence was certainly not good.


We have Cops for a reason. You dont think their doing a good enough job? Get your ass off the couch, go to school, and get a badge pined to your shirt . At least then when you shoot some un-armed criminal, you can get paid leave while waiting for the inquest.

I have nothing wrong with cops. There are often scenarios where the cops can't get there fast enough. For example, the story you said with the baseball bat. For all you know, it was two armed gangbangers that could have shot at you the minute you stepped out with a bat. Fact of the matter is that the cops can't be teleported to the scene. It takes time to get there. Under certain circumstances, you have to take matters into your own hands. Shooting people in the back is certainly not the right way to do it, as I mentioned earlier.


So Cops should just shoot, instead of arrest?
You're taking this one completely out of context. What I was referring to, is that if someone breaks into your house, citizens should have the right to protect themselves and their families. Unfortunately, that is not the case in Wisconsin.


And you think Adrial is a good candidate for CC? A "law-abiding citizen"? A good candidate for CC is one who knows right from wrong. One that can use good judgment in a time of crisis. From what I've seen, most here do not fit that requirement. I'm shocked a lot of you passed hunter safety.

Once again, I am not saying what he did was justifiable. I clearly stated what he did was a mistake. I certainly didn't make mention that he would be a good candidate for CC. People that shoot others in the back while fleeing empower all of the anti-gunners. The whole point of my post was the fact that criminals have all the power in Wisconsin. They carry guns. They can break into your house, get hurt, then turn around and sue you. A criminal can hold up a gas station, but heaven forbid the shop keeper shoots the perp. As far as a lot of us not fitting the requirement for CC, look at all the wonderful people in the Milwaukee area that are walking around with guns. These are the same individuals that murder, rape, and steal. Are they good candidates?

I don't agree that shooting them was right, but at the same time, that was the risk that they were willing to take when they decided they were going to steal a stereo. A criminal is a criminal. If that's the life style a person chooses, that's the type of stuff that happens.

[SpdRcrZ]

^ I'm not even going to reply to that thread, BLATANT racism ruins any form of intelligent debate. Good job!
:thumbsup I must have missed the racism, but thanks for pointing it out to me. :goof


Once again, I am not saying what he did was justifiable. I clearly stated what he did was a mistake. I certainly didn't make mention that he would be a good candidate for CC. People that shoot others in the back while fleeing empower all of the anti-gunners. The whole point of my post was the fact that criminals have all the power in Wisconsin. They carry guns. They can break into your house, get hurt, then turn around and sue you. A criminal can hold up a gas station, but heaven forbid the shop keeper shoots the perp. As far as a lot of us not fitting the requirement for CC, look at all the wonderful people in the Milwaukee area that are walking around with guns. These are the same individuals that murder, rape, and steal. Are they good candidates?

I've argued the same thing, that its the law abiding citizens who are the "un-armed" in Wisconsin. I am all for CC for that very reason. But at the same time, people who justify what Adrial did, argue for CC. Those are the people who make CC look bad in the first place.

I am all for protecting yourself IN YOUR HOUSE. If these 3 had broken into Adrial's house, anything that happened to them they would have coming. A jury, even here in WI, would have a hard time convicting him of murder...... as long as he called the cops, and didnt try to cover it up.

Moral of the story, stealing is wrong, shooting someone in the back and killing them is murder. The actions of Adrial White can in no way be justified, no matter how you twist it. They did not pose a threat to his life. They where not armed. And when confronted they fled.



I am not married, yet. And I personally think I did quiet well for myself thank you!!! But on to the bumper sticker, FYI it actually reads "Kill them all and let God sort them out!":rolf

glad you didnt take it personally..... ;) 90% of what I say is sarcasm.

[nitrous]

Liberal.